this post was submitted on 14 May 2024
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Do any of them know what the word "liberal" actually means?

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Don't know why you're being downvoted.

Liberal literally means free. As in "If it doesn't harm me, you're allowed to do it". So yes, openminded, permissive, tolerant.

Don't know why a lot of the US-Americans had to twist the meaning of it.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Because in politics, liberal means something else entirely. It's an ideology defined by support for capitalism.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

In Americans politics, and you guys are completely bonkers.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 5 months ago

It's actually specifically not true in American politics.

Liberal in America = left wing, favors greater regulation of markets

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

That's absolutely not what it means

In the very closest definition, liberal means "if there isn't a law against it, you're allowed to do it"

liberal more broadly is just as simple: "if it doesn't hurt me, you're free to do it"

I mean, what do you think a "liberal democracy" is? The majority of Europe is made up of liberal democracies while also being social-democratic. France is a liberal democracy despite being heavily unionized and having huge welfare. How does that work?

It works because that's not what liberal means.

Socially-Liberal, for example, is when you are liberal (freedom-loving / diversity-loving) in social aspects. You support gay marriages, you support freedom of religion, you support cultural diversity. Other Examples include religiously-liberal, culturally-liberal, or even politically liberal (you support the right to different political opinions than yours)

What comes closest to what you think it is is economically-liberal. Which essentially says that "as long as it doesn't hurt me, you're free to do what you want economically". But even that isn't what you mean. Is Pollution and accelerating Climate change harming me and therefore not protected under liberalism? yes, says the absolute majority of liberals.

Is lobbying harming me by making my Voice less weighted? Yes, say a lot of us.

So not even economically-liberal is a good term to describe what you mean.

I don't know, what a good term for it is. But it isn't Liberal. So please, for the love of god, stop misusing it. Words have meaning. Invent a new one if you have to, they all began that way anyways.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The problem here is that in the US it means a very specific thing, while in Europe it means another specific thing. I think it gets mentioned every other time when this holywar reappears in comments

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism_in_Europe https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberalism_in_the_United_States https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_liberalism_in_the_United_States

[–] [email protected] -1 points 5 months ago

Which would be fine except the fucking Europeans keep insisting the American definition is WRONG and refuse to use it, making communication very difficult.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

In European politics.

American liberals do not support free markets. They're advocates of greater regulation amd stronger unions.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

yes, they do. Both* US political parties are neoliberal parties. Regulation of markets is still a free market. Unions do not inherently oppose free markets either.

* must go back at least 10 years for this to be true for Republicans

[–] [email protected] -1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Stop prevaricating.

More regulation = less free markets. It's a spectrum, not a light switch. Dems want more restricted markets. Repubs want more free markets.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It sounds to me like you don't know what a market economy is.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 5 months ago

It’s a spectrum, not a light switch.

Truth so obvious it should be self evident, and yet here we are