this post was submitted on 10 Sep 2023
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MeanwhileOnGrad

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"Oh, this is calamity! Calamity! Oh no, he's on the floor!"

Welcome to MoG!


Meanwhile On Grad


Documenting hate speech, conspiracy theories, apologia/revisionism, and general tankie behaviour across the fediverse. Memes are welcome!


What is a Tankie?


Alternatively, a detailed blog post about Tankies.

(caution of biased source)


Basic Rules:

Sh.itjust.works Instance rules apply! If you are from other instances, please be mindful of the rules. — Basically, don't be a dick.

Hate-Speech — You should be familiar with this one already; practically all instances have the same rules on hate speech.

Apologia(Using the Modern terminology for Apologia) No Defending, Denying, Justifying, Bolstering, or Differentiating authoritarian acts or endeavours, whether be a Pro-CCP viewpoint, Stalinism, Islamic Terrorism or any variation of Tankie Ideology.

Revisionism — No downplaying or denying atrocities past and present. Calling Tankies shills, foreign/federal agents, or bots also falls under this rule. Extremists exist. They are real. Do not call them shills or fake users as it handwaves their extremism.

Tankies can explain their views but may be criticised or attacked for them. Any slight infraction on the rules above will immediately earn a warning and possibly a ban.

Off-topic Discussion — Do not discuss unrelated topics to the point of derailing the thread. Stay focused on the direct content of the post as opposed to arguing.

You'll be warned if you're violating the instance and community rules. Continuing poor behaviour after being warned will result in a ban or removal of your comments. Bans typically only last 24 hours, but each subsequent infraction will double the amount. Depending on the content, the ban time may be increased. You may request an unban at any time.


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[–] [email protected] 69 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

"Like China, our struggle sessions will purify The Party and bring unity to our socialist utopia"

Also, isn't Beehaw like, a bunch of fuckin' hippies? Like the kind of people you'd have to be insane to call fascists?

[–] [email protected] 53 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Hexbear users are pretty stupid because they almost exclusively alienate would-be supporters, or at least close allies.

They fundamentally cannot see the difference between any non-communist liberals (left) and fascism.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Liberals? Fascists. Social democrats? Fascists. Democratic socialists? Fascists. Anarcho-communists? Fascists.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Communists?

Believe it or not, also fascists.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

Funnily enough this one is far more correct than the others.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 year ago

They just believe anyone who isn't with them is against them. It's a common human failing.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 year ago

Tankies have an incredibly black and white view of the world. Anyone that isn't with them is a fascist. It's also why they can't accept that their favorite authoritarians have practiced imperialism, oppression of minority groups, and lots of killing. "Stalin believed in the same economic policy that I do, so therefore he never did a bad thing."

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago

Like the kind of people you'd have to be insane to call fascists?

Well, it is Hexbear...

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 year ago

Hexbears say that anyone who's against them are fascists so I'm not really surprised.

[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Shit like this is why I don't get (some of) the LGBTQ community's fascination with communism and tankies.

They have proven themselves just as anti-LGBTQ as the fascists.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 year ago (70 children)

communism and tankies

pick one, because they are not interchangeable.
One is antithetical to authoritarianism, and the other seeks nothing but.
There is plenty of good reason for LGBTQ+ folks to be attracted to communism.

[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Anarcho-communism is antithetical to authoritarianism. But the use of the word today is nearly synonymous with Lenin’s or Bolshevik’s communism (and their further variations by multiple future parties, like Mao-communism), because this was the only flavor that actually existed as ideology in countries where communist parties were/are in power.

You my run with your own definition of communism being of a particular flavor, but you will always face people that do not understand you, because the common definition is not that.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 year ago

The tankies scream real loud that they're communist. So it's pretty easy to get confused.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Absolutely true.

There are, however, for some unfathomable reason, queer tankies. That, I do not understand.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago

Same type of people as Log Cabin Republicans

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Think of it this way - you're a queer person who has struggled most of your life to feel safe and accepted. Then you meet a community that tells you all transphobes get the firing squad. Suddenly you feel safe, accepted, and like you matter. That emotional contrast is veryy appealing and addicting.

Nevermind that in real life, if you were putting people to the firing squads for as little as saying "neopronouns are stupid" will actually just make the majority of people fear and hate the queer community in the long run.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago

and also in real life the soviet union regularly executed queers

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago

There were also Jews for Hitler.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (1 children)

They are so desperate for validations they've managed to twist this into evidence of communism as a superior ideology.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago (49 children)

It's hard to argue that communism as imagined by the tankies is better in any way than the souless capitalism that we all suffer under. However, real communism as imagined by Marx (but not Lenin) is vastly superior.

See, Marx saw the workers owning the means of production on a local scale. The example being factory workers owning the factory they worked in. Workers would directly profit from their own labor.

Lenin envisioned the State owning the means of production. Workers would work for the good of the State, or else.

Marx postulated that economies followed a sort of progression, feudalism led to capitalism, which in turn led to communism.

Unfortunately, the real world doesn't work in neat, linear progressions.

Marx imagined a utopia, and Lenin, in an attempt to create something like it, reinvented feudalism with different masters. Which is not surprising, as Russia was still living under feudalism when Lenin was born.


My prediction for the future of government is as follows; as the climate crisis and automation crisis progress, there will be four types of government.

The first are failed states. They will have lost the climate roulette. Their populations are either fled or dead.

The second are puppet states. These will exist mostly for resource extraction. Their populations will still exist, but many will have fled or died. The rest will toil in resource extraction to feed the last two categories.

The penultimate is the fascist police state. China and Russia are well on their way to this outcome, and the US is actively flirting with it. This is the end game of capitalism. A new feudalism where the serfs are disposable and interchangeable, instead of tied to the land and part of an inheritance. The only saving grace is that fascism always leads to an unstable mess of a government that almost inevitably crashes and burns when the strongman dictator dies.

The final category is the automated utopia. Automation takes off fast enough to put everyone out of work, and the governments realize that money is just something we made up and decides to just let anyone have whatever they want (within reason) because it takes no human effort to produce anything.

The automated utopia is a dream, I hope it happens. It would look sort of like a cross between Marx's dream of communism and UBI with no strings attached.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 year ago

Didn't they do exactly what Beehaw is considering? Their "survival" so far has been mostly in isolation, but now that they've refederated they act like they were here the whole time.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I must have missed the chapter in the Manifesto where it's not communism until it's only expressed in "dunk culture" rhetoric.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago

No amount of rhetoric will ever convince me that someone who engages in the act of "dunking" is supposed to be taken seriously... The word sounds like a family-friendly replacement for what should be profanity.

Either own it and say that you're using provocation as a "90s flame war tactic" or get dunked right back into the kiddie pool.

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I respect Beehaw for striving against all the odds to make a non-toxic space for their users on the internet. They do come across like the the summer of 67 of the Fedi.

That said the communities I've subscribed to are large but the conversations aren't that vibrant.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The admins are certainly toxic though. Any criticism of them whatsoever results in an immediate ban.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

dialectical perspective

Fuckin lol

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Every bloody time I see the word "dialectical" or "dialectic" or any of its other forms I get annoyed because I go look up the definition and stare at it for 10 minutes and STILL aren't sure what the fuck it means.

Seriously people LOOK at this hot mess.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Personally I don't really care. Beehaw's shit and the mods spend more time chatting on discord than actually modding their instance.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

and the mods spend more time chatting on discord than actually modding their instance.

Lmao well said.

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