this post was submitted on 21 Feb 2024
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neurodiverse

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What is Neurodivergence?

It's ADHD, Autism, OCD, schizophrenia, anxiety, depression, bi-polar, aspd, etc etc etc etc

“neurologically atypical patterns of thought or behavior”

So, it’s very broad, if you feel like it describes you then it does as far as we're concerned


Rules

1.) ableist language=post or comment will probably get removed (enforced case by case, some comments will be removed and restored due to complex situations). repeated use of ableist language=banned from comm and possibly site depending on severity. properly tagged posts with CW can use them for the purposes of discussing them

2.) always assume good faith when dealing with a fellow nd comrade especially due to lack of social awareness being a common symptom of neurodivergence

2.5) right to disengage is rigidly enforced. violations will get you purged from the comm. see rule 3 for explanation on appeals

3.) no talking over nd comrades about things you haven't personally experienced as a neurotypical chapo, you will be purged. If you're ND it is absolutely fine to give your own perspective if it conflicts with another's, but do so with empathy and the intention to learn about each other, not prove who's experience is valid. Appeal process is like appealing in user union but you dm the nd comrade you talked over with your appeal (so make it a good one) and then dm the mods with screenshot proof that you resolved it. fake screenies will get you banned from the site, we will confirm with the comrade you dm'd.

3.5) everyone has their own lived experiences, and to invalidate them is to post cringe. comments will be removed on a case by case basis depending on determined level of awareness and faith

4.) Interest Policing will not be tolerated in any form. Support your comrades in their joy!

Further rules to be added/ rules to be changed based on community input

RULES NOTE: For this community more than most we understand that the clarity and understandability of these rules is very important for allowing folks to feel comfortable, to that end please don't be afraid to be outspoken about amendments and addendums to these rules, as well as any we may have missed

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Sometimes, it depends. In a professional setting I might do more eye contact than when I'm hanging out with a friend smoking a j and talking while we lean over a railing somewhere.

as @[email protected] said showing active listening is IMO more important than where you look at someone while you talk, but again the importance of eye contact is contextual.

if you want to practice eye contact, try looking in only one of their eyes vs some random space on the face (ie: between the eyes, or the nose or mouth)

[–] [email protected] 18 points 9 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago

anytime buddy

[–] [email protected] 23 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Eye contact is a fucking lost cause. Best I can do is lookin' at your shoulder, maybe your hands or somethin'.

Reading the replies in this thread is like hearing someone describe an overly complex speedrun strat that relies on an obscure time-sensitive glitch in the game. I could learn C++ or something easier than normative eye contact.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 9 months ago (1 children)

sometimes but it depends on the situation and some is good but too much can make people uncomfortable

i think the main thing is people are going to be aware of signs that you're engaged with what they're saying, that you're actively listening. that can include things like nodding your head, saying mmhmm or the like, sometimes eye contact or looking at them, but most people will be perfectly fine if you're not looking at them most of the time you're talking to them as long as you're "checking in" every so often to indicate that they have your attention.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I'm doing sales training and reading books on the topic and they converge to consensus to agree about verbal bridges "hmmm, yes, sure, absolutely, fair enough." I don't even want to shit on it because the emphasis always seems to be on increasing your capacity to listen to others, help them feel understood, and be curious about them whether it's because they have a problem you can solve or, as I've felt in my life, because they want to talk about themselves. If more people stopped waiting for their turn to talk and started asking people to dig into what they just said, the world would be a better place, so fair play as far as I'm concerned.

The orthodox methods seems as if the primary purpose of eye contact is more clear communication. Basically, less than half of communication is the words you use. It's the difference between "press the communism button" like Joe Biden can do at any moment because he has one on his desk. And "PRESS THE COMMUNISM BUTTON" because the building is collapsing around you and the Dark Brandon Bots are breaking through the firey rubble so it's our only chance.

To that end, your tonality and body language combine to make the majority of what people take away from you. I've had it asserted that your facial expressions are the steering wheel to your tonality, so if you want use tones like curious, skeptical, and challenging or another suite like in control, happy, and late night DJ, then you'll be contorting your face. THEREFORE eye contact is often important to pick up on cues as to what message someone is sending. Essentially, the answer to whether they're asking you to press the communism button on your desk or the Dark Brandon Bots are breaking through the rubble is written on their face. So if you get the memo, you don't have to keep looking for it in their eyes, you can stop staring. If you don't find any expression on their face, it might be a cue to get them to elaborate on how they're feeling/what they're thinking.

If you're both on the pier looking at the sunset, surely you don't ignore the sunset to stare at their side profile, maybe just look over at a point of emphasis. So it's all relative and it depends. Sometimes portraying you have a flat affect and only the words need to be the focus is the message. Other times you can use a curious tone to pry at why someone close to you is upset.

I hope this helps to make eye contact seem less arbitrary and simply societal expectation.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I'm looking at you right now.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 9 months ago
[–] [email protected] 18 points 9 months ago

yeah the others said it well but i want to really emphasize that you only look a little bit sometimes to show that you aren't distracted by something else. if you look someone in the eye constantly it can be seen as creepy. if you don't look at all it can be seen as lack of interest.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Yes. Also eye contact, specifically meaning look at their eyes every few seconds or so but mostly just look in their direction. Focusing on a spot just in front of their nose is a good thing to remember.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 9 months ago

gotcha. i feel like i am too intensely focusing on someone when i look in their eyes lol

[–] [email protected] 16 points 8 months ago

tequila-sunset I just hit them with The Expression

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago

It helps to at least be looking in their general direction, yeah.

You don't need to be looking at them closely enough to see how wide their pupils are, but you at least want a gaze that's within 15 degrees of their eyes or so.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 8 months ago

Yes, but it sucks

[–] [email protected] 9 points 8 months ago

People expect it as 'etiquette' in most of the western world. I try to avoid it because people instinctively act like I caught their soul exposed naked in the shower when I do. It's really strange.

So I'll contact ever so briefly to let rhem know I see them and continue looking kind of at them.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 8 months ago

sometimes, the rules are arbitrary

[–] [email protected] 9 points 8 months ago

When I was a child, like 4 years old or so, when I wanted to get my mom's attention to tell her something, I would say, "Mom, Mom, Mom". I could see that she was looking straight at me, but I would keep calling her until she verbally said "What?" To me. Like, almost as though I didn't believe that I really had her attention until she would verbally reply. I think eye contact is essentially the adult neurotypical analogue to that. Without eye contact (mostly when you're being spoken to), peeps struggle to believe that you're tuned in

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I'm always scared that I'll look like I'm staring

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

i've decided this year that i'm gonna try staring more, just to see what happens

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I dunno, man. I usually just focus on whatever I'm doing when talking to someone, and shift to briefly make eye contact and nod once in a while to reassure them that I'm listening.

However, if someone's saying something particularly important, like providing crucial instruction on something, I do maintain steady eye contact.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 8 months ago

yes and it's tiring

[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 months ago

Yes it’s one of the best ways to communicate without using words.

Part of the reason it’s socially expected is that without practice most people cant really conceal their emotions and despite what we might think about society a huge part of it has to do with communicating emotion.

If you feel exposed or uncomfortable, practice looking in your own eyes in a mirror and controlling your expression.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

US norms hold that you look at them but not too much. Rarely make direct eye contact, but do so sometimes. If you look at someone too long they think it's too intense but if you don't look enough they think you're awkward.

You might want to practice in a mirror. Looking at someone's face for about 5 seconds before glancing away is a good baseline.

PS this is just tips if you wanna blend no judgment here I personally don't care whether someone looks at my face.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 months ago

count the intervals between blinks

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago

It's a normie thing supposedly

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 months ago

I do. Then they nervous or uncomfortable and look away lol. I win

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

its weird but yeah. don't stress about it too much. i'm bad at it, so i find myself relying more on verbal cues to indicate attention, and i think it works okay for the most part. it does mean that every single one of my friends is autistic, so pretty much a win.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

Depends on a lot of stuff. If you're trying too deescalate a tense situation, standing at an obtuse angle along side them and looking forward can be helpful. If you have trouble with eye contact, look at the bridge of their nose or along their jaw line.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

I dunno, I've never been the most comfortable with eye contact so I've gotten used to looking at the bridge of the nose or their forehead, I think it's close enough

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago

Kinda yeah but i got away with staring the floor to the left of them for 30 years

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

full one-on-one eye contact is pretty intense and not usually necessary or desired, but at least in their general direction is good, IMO

[–] [email protected] 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Probably but I’ll be damned if I will. They all can stuff their cues and gestures up their ass