This is a great example of the fallacy fallacy.
A fallacious argument is not necessarily an incorrect one.
this post was submitted on 07 Feb 2024
570 points (93.8% liked)
Lemmy Shitpost
26691 readers
3908 users here now
Welcome to Lemmy Shitpost. Here you can shitpost to your hearts content.
Anything and everything goes. Memes, Jokes, Vents and Banter. Though we still have to comply with lemmy.world instance rules. So behave!
Rules:
1. Be Respectful
Refrain from using harmful language pertaining to a protected characteristic: e.g. race, gender, sexuality, disability or religion.
Refrain from being argumentative when responding or commenting to posts/replies. Personal attacks are not welcome here.
...
2. No Illegal Content
Content that violates the law. Any post/comment found to be in breach of common law will be removed and given to the authorities if required.
That means:
-No promoting violence/threats against any individuals
-No CSA content or Revenge Porn
-No sharing private/personal information (Doxxing)
...
3. No Spam
Posting the same post, no matter the intent is against the rules.
-If you have posted content, please refrain from re-posting said content within this community.
-Do not spam posts with intent to harass, annoy, bully, advertise, scam or harm this community.
-No posting Scams/Advertisements/Phishing Links/IP Grabbers
-No Bots, Bots will be banned from the community.
...
4. No Porn/Explicit
Content
-Do not post explicit content. Lemmy.World is not the instance for NSFW content.
-Do not post Gore or Shock Content.
...
5. No Enciting Harassment,
Brigading, Doxxing or Witch Hunts
-Do not Brigade other Communities
-No calls to action against other communities/users within Lemmy or outside of Lemmy.
-No Witch Hunts against users/communities.
-No content that harasses members within or outside of the community.
...
6. NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.
-Content that is NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.
-Content that might be distressing should be kept behind NSFW tags.
...
If you see content that is a breach of the rules, please flag and report the comment and a moderator will take action where they can.
Also check out:
Partnered Communities:
1.Memes
10.LinuxMemes (Linux themed memes)
Reach out to
All communities included on the sidebar are to be made in compliance with the instance rules. Striker
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Don't fall prey to the fallacy fallacy fallacy.
A fallacious argument whose only logical protection is the fallacy fallacy is a fallacy.
This whole thing is too phallus-y for me.
Same here, i can only take at most two fallacies at once, so this is simply too much
Stop talking and we can take a third. Peace be with you.
How about phalluses?
Isn’t it phallusi?
Phallusy? or Falussy? Think about it.
I could go for some falussy, you right.
There's no such thing as "too phallus-y"!
This is the only time so far I've seen "fallacy fallacy" used correctly and not being used, ironically fallaciously, as if it automatically cancels out every fallacy in a person's argument automatically making it valid.
Especially when the speaker isn't a trained orator who knows to avoid that as much as possible during an argument
Or when objectivity is not called for. All those fallacies and "unfair strategies" are described as they are in order to keep objective discussions at said objective level. Yet, when the discussion by it's nature cannot be objective, none of those "fallacies" apply as fallacies.
Besides: An appeal is not a bad tactic in any way, shape or form.
An appeal to emotion, when you're trying to prove your case on its logical merits alone, isn't helpful.
X is good because y and z are true. As opposed to X is good because all my friends like it.
Most often appeals to emotion are kind of necessary. Issues are rarely so black and white as try be purely logical.
Ex is good because when my homies drop ex they have a great night. No Ex is bad for you. But consenting adults being what they are.... Etc etc.
These aren't fallacious arguments in this case though
That's the joke.
Hmm, I read your comment as serious. My mistake
If you know enough fallacy types you can basically regress any argument to a set of fallacies. Good job you now have the super power to suggest anything said by anyone is a fallacy. Go and use your powers for being extremely annoying and super counter productive.
That's where the fallacy fallacy comes into play. It's the ultimate trap card for those obsessed with pointing out fallacies.
The uno reverse?
Bug lite?
Slowly going away. I remember, when I was a kid, out during the summer in the backyard. You would see so many of these little fuckers in every direction you look. Just all over the place. Now, during the summer, you are lucky to see one every few minutes.
I still see a lot of them in the summer where I live now!
So....you stole them from here? You bastard.
I didn't, but we could always use more...
I didn't but I want them so bad i would do anything, absolutely anything to get them
That's what I just heard.
Where I live they seem to come and go. Some years there's literally zero, then a few years later there'll be so many you almost don't wanna go outside because they might get in your mouth. Although admittedly I haven't seen the usual swarms lately either. It's long overdue and yet they're not here.
It's a big change from when I was a kid, still living in this same area, but we had a consistent, manageable number of fireflies every year.
Slowly going away.
Ya just like my dad! He’d go on increasingly longer business trips before divorcing my mom and taking all the money. Eyoooooooooooo 🤙
OH MY GOD IM CUMMING
This is how my ex would react when I tried to leave her because the relationship was toxic.
Screaming at me about how she hates being with me then straight to the manipulating when I tried to cut it off
Sounds like narcissistic tendencies, when you stop feeding them they come back.
Had an ex like this too, the moment I called her bluff and said I was going to grab boxes to move out she changed her tune since the power dynamic shifted. Then she wrapped the conversation around how we should try again and it wasn't that big of a deal what I'd done, etc.
Most of them just don't want to admit anything they've ever said was wrong so the perspective changes and gaslighting starts to creep in.
That whole power dynamic thing was insane. For nearly 3 years my ex would throw me out, call me back, sit up in the bed and say, “I just don’t love you anymore.” I’d go stay at my mom’s, cry myself to sleep, get a random message a few weeks later, “We can work it out. Come home. No sex or anything, we’ll just watch tv shows and spend time together.” Oh, seems to be going alright, BAM, “I don’t love you anymore. Leave.”
I told her one time, “you’re going to make me leave, I’m going to randomly bump into a woman who is going through the same shit I am, we’ll bond, and I won’t come home when you ask me to. You keep playing these games, eventually you’ll lose.”
Well, I met someone else. She lost her fucking mind. Instantly, all of the power she had over me jumped into my hands like a bolt of lightning. I didn’t want it. I just wanted the chaos to end. I wanted to move on with my life and try to rebuild it.
She nearly drove me insane. She did everything she could to run my girlfriend off. She texted her mother, told her all this crazy shit. She texted her friends, said I was an abusive monster and she was just concerned. She told me she’d kill herself if I didn’t come right away in the middle of the night. I was afraid she’d do it, she had already pulled so much of her hair out that she was nearly bald. She seriously lost her shit. The look on her face when she held that power, I had never seen it on her before. She knew she had it, and she used every ounce of it on a whim to see me squirm I think. The second she lost it she was reduced to an infant.
Humans are insane. That time in my life taught me lessons I wish I hadn’t learned, but I am glad I did. I believe I would handle it all better if it ever happened again.
This is how you escape the matrix
Logic is a incomplete mental discipline and can only be helpful in artificially axiomatic and simplified situations.
All formal logic is circular. The premise(s) must be an axiom beyond question. So you need knowledge to get knowledge. This is why moral claims like "it's bad to murder" are beyond logical examination. Any attempt will require an argument like "murder does harm" which relies on the moral claim that "it's bad to harm", and round and round we go.
Logic is a word game. Every semantic argument proves that controlling a definition can change the conclusion. A sort of alchemy where language shaped reality rather than being a description of it. As if you could drive home in the word car.
The Vulcan, making all decisions with logic alone would be paralyzed and helpless.
While what you wrote is very intelligent sounding, "doing harm is bad" isnt a moral statement. Harm by definition is bad outside of any system of morality. You can break down any situation into a set of logical proposals, but not without consequences. How much of an autist the gentleman in the picture is being is really what prevents him from clearly seeing the shittiness of his decision. Calling your hysterical wife that youre leaving after 15 years slave to the sunk cost fallacy isnt logic. It's being a terrible person.
What if doing a little harm today leads to more good tomorrow (so, a net positive amount of good)? And in a year? And in two centuries?
A decision can be objectively moral and the outcome can be objectively positive, and yet the enacting of the "correct" decision can still be done in such a way as to maximize harm, rather than minimize.
The person you respond to says that calling the wife a slave to the sunk cost fallacy is cruel, and that is correct. You shouldn't measure only the logical, correct, desirable outcome, but also the compassion and humanity with which you attempt to realize that outcome.
All this for a comic which is boomer "wife bad."
I think that's more, 'edgy' incel humour, than your standard boomer contempt-of-partner knee slapper.
The easiest way to tell your making a semantic argument is when you literally use the phrase "by definition".
Your
The internet debate lord never admits defeat
Well yes this is a shit post.
The plot of Our Flag Means Death in a nutshell.