this post was submitted on 14 Dec 2023
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[–] [email protected] 90 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Bold claim when you remember all of the horrific UI that car manufacturers utilized before everyone started using Apple and Google's UI. Sometimes I have to borrow an old car from someone and you just can't find anything. Really, I'm more in favor of bringing back physical buttons for all basic functions, but a good UI will not only make it quick and easy to say change to the next song or view trip details, but it will also prevent you from performing more complicated tasks while in motion. We'll see what GM's solution is, but I have little faith.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago

Physical buttons are things I don't have to look at when I'm driving. That's good.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

In my opinion there is a balance, where things you use commonly while driving are physical controls, and everything else is touch screen. But it seems like literally no one knows how to do this.

[–] [email protected] 64 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

Yeah because I'm sure GM's shit will be better. Idek why I'm addressing this: ~~we all know GM doesn't want to pay Apple or Google~~. That this is really about more renting and never owning. They just want more money.

GM, just say that. We know you're a gigantic money-hungry corp. You all don't have to lie and pretend to care about safety. We're not a bunch of idiots. We get it, even if you all suck for doing this.

I'd say I hope GM crashes and burns again, but then the government will just bail them out again.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

I thought Android auto was free.

This is all about maintaining and selling your data for themselves. There was just a report out last week about how cars are one of the most data insecure devices you can own because of how poorly all the big auto manufacturers treat their customers.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Do you mean Android Auto, or Android Automotive (what's being used here)?

I assumed/got the impression that the latter cost money to integrators (GM) but I guess I don't know for sure.

Android Auto is "free" to end-users but is different.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Ah I stand corrected on the Android side. I assumed there was some licensing going on. I'll correct that.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago

I believe there is, for Android Automotive.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago

We know you're a gigantic money-hungry corp. You all don't have to lie and pretend to care about safety. We're not a bunch of idiots.

Alas, as long as there is doubt, there are a large number of suckers who are willing to give the benefit of the doubt. We are a bunch of idiots, collectively. That's why shit like this works.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I doubt it’s about paying Apple or Google, so um much as their ability to extort car owners to pay them. Nobody in their right mind will buy the $10/month Bullshit Subscription (TM) from GM when they can just plug in their phone and use Waze.

Edit: seems Apple doesnt charge automakers so it’s definitely about extorting you for money.

[–] [email protected] 46 points 10 months ago (4 children)

To achieve this, GM’s new system — called Ultifi, which is making its debut in the 2024 Chevy Blazer EV — uses Google apps built right into the system, like Google Maps and Assistant, which GM hopes customers will use for more voice controls. It can handle things like calls and texts, and it can control the audio and climate systems.

Now you have an embedded Android device that is never gonna be upgraded for the lifetime of the car.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 10 months ago (1 children)

GM Single handedly keeping aftermarket stereos relevant. I wouldn't buy a car with this solution.

Android auto upgrades with my devices. It's the best solution.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago (3 children)

I highly doubt an aftermarket unit will work. Today, most units are integrated into the entire car system. Removing the unit from my car would mean losing access to a lot of functionality. I doubt the car would even accept a 3rd party unit. And this is not a Tesla.

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[–] [email protected] 45 points 10 months ago (2 children)

What's unsafe is having to navigate a giant fischer price interface whenever you want to adjust the A/C

[–] [email protected] 12 points 10 months ago (1 children)

GM doesn't get to sell your data.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago

Silly me, not thinking of the poor little corporations again

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago

Chevy is still all about knobs, which is the proper way to create car controls. Ford is pretty heavy into a full touch screen control center, which is really annoying as a driver.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 10 months ago (1 children)

They’re going about this all wrong.

Apple car is not the issue. It’s all the other touch inputs that I have on my car to control every basic function like the climate controls and other shit.

Apple car switches on, already the navigation is setup and the music is on… I don’t need to touch it again. I can switch songs on my steering wheel and I can ask Siri for basic shit like finding a playlist.

I don’t need to go through a touch menu or button to change the temperature or any other action setting while in motion.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

in fact, much of CarPlay's functionality becomes locked while the car is in motion, making that a moot point anyway, lol. the only things left to distract or endanger would be the OEM stuff, as you mention.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago (2 children)

The one unsafe thing in car play for me is the tiny stupid UI element needed to switch betweeen voice directions/alerts only/silent/.

I will quite often want to switch modes while on a long journey - full directions while driving on backstreets, alerts only while on motorways.

Have yet to find the Siri command to switch between them. Anyone know of one?

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[–] [email protected] 43 points 10 months ago

"It's unsafe for Apple and Android to prevent us from monopolizing your user data!"

[–] [email protected] 34 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Cool, then I’m dropping GM from my list of cars that I’ll buy or rent. CarPlay is a must have in 2023, just like a backup camera. Literally nobody wants your shitty car OS thing, it’s guaranteed to be way worse than iOS and Android.

Seems like this ought to be a dealbreaker for many.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

GM was never on the list anyway, i've tried a couple ones and i was always surprised how much money they want for their cheap ass interior

[–] [email protected] 27 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The fact that cars have touch screens and capacitive surfaces are what makes them unsafe. Physical buttons work with apple car play and android auto and make them safer

[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 months ago

Capacitive buttons need to die a painful death. I'm ok with some functions being capacitive or touch screen buttons, like little unimportant ones like accessing my 6th favourite radio station or whatever. Or even Carplay or Android Auto.

But when it comes to operating the HVAC or shifting gears, it shouldn't be allowed that these aren't mechanical switches with proper fail-safe backups. I don't even think those shifter buttons in a lot of modern vehicles, or the shifting knobs, like what's been in the Jeep SUVs for the past decade, are the best idea.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 months ago (5 children)

Car manufacturers should get out of the dashboard design business. Just have an API standard for devices to control the car, and a USB port for users to plug in whichever device works best for them. You want a bunch of physical buttons? Cool, go down to AutoZone and buy a button panel that matches your needs. You want a big screen with carplay and a bunch of widgets? Mount your old iPad there.

The regulatory side would be the hard part. Devices would have to meet some safety standards and the car would have to refuse to drive unless an approved dashboard was connected, but it could be done.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago

But there's no money in that...

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago

Let's be honest, GM can't make money off owners using this software. They can make their own and have owners pay a subscription like some Tesla owners do now.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

You know what's unsafe? Putting a long-ass disclosure about keeping your eyes on the road that you have to close before you can use your infotainment center. We know how to drive, dude. Adding a distraction doesn't improve safety, it makes it worse.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (3 children)

I'm dropping GM, because they are unsafe. I'm not going back to looking down at my phone while I'm driving.

Also, as a former 2005 Chevrolet Cobalt owner, I'd love to have a good chat about safety with the executives of GM. That is, if they aren't too busy creating their new in-dash subscription model. Which is what this is really about, and we all know it.

Maybe they should first focus on their gross manufacturing shortfalls, and their other issues. Maybe take a look at that parking lot in Pontiac that's bursting at the seams with Corvettes stuck in limbo, and their very pissed off purchasers.

Fuck. What a bunch of numbskulls.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Wait your counterargument to this is "it's unsafe to remove the unsafe feature, because now im going to use my phone, the exact thing that's unsafe"

What? "How could you make me do this" energy.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago (2 children)

So I'm assuming that means that they're admitting that they put a safety hazard in all those prior cars and are assuming liability for every accident where infotainment systems may have been involved, right?

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago (6 children)

I've a Mazda with Android Auto that doesn't use a touch screen. It's all controlled with a joystick/knob/button setup that is actually really nice. I wish my Nissan had a similar setup all the time.

In the Mazda I know how many physical interactions will get me the result I want, it takes barely more than a glance at the screen to know what's up. With the touch interface I have to put my eyes on the screen to confirm that the car didn't bounce when I went to tap a "button" and/or confirm that the tap was actually registered. I know that GM has to know that Android Auto supports non touchscreen interactions. If they're concerned about how unsafe touchscreens are, just add a knob to the center console that doubles as a 4-way joystick like Mazda has and all those concerns go away. It's really that simple and it IS miles better than using touch for everything.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago

Yeah, I do enjoy jumping into my wife's Mazda every now and then, for just this reason. Touch screens requires too much attention be diverted away from the critical task of driving, as people need to look at the screen for the purpose of aiming a finger at a control on it.

The steering wheel controls for my Ford's Sync are good for volume, music back/forward, and phone calls, but that's it. It's the reason I still need to use a voice assistant while driving. I really hate using the touch screen except at the start or end of journey.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago

It’s a very thin argument about it being buggy and/or users picking up their phones when that happens. There’s no way they have data to quantify that. I use voice commands exclusively and as others have said the only things I wrestle with are climate and non-integrated functions. It’s way safer to do AA or CarPlay in my experience.

It’s GMs bet to lose here. I would immediately pass on a vehicle without CarPlay. My old Toyota had a horrible interface and I was quoted $300 just to update the map, not even a new radio, literally just a software update. No thank you.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Like, could I just have the aux jack back please? I can frig with my phone before I put the car in drive and just push audio through the speakers, I don't need to be able to sort through my playlists or make calls from the steering wheel, I'm distracted enough by billboards, for chrissakes. The only thing I like about my phone being connected to my car is that I can skip forward and back, that's it.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago

And with proper software support, the aux jack can do some limited pause/forward/back!

I do really like Android Auto, but the reliability of the Aux connection is something I very sorely miss.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Yeah what’s up with that?! My new car comes with a host of connection possibilities, but lacks a simple jack. I still use that 5th gen iPod, is it too much to ask for a connector?

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (1 children)

They are doing it to light up revenue streams.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

literally any change or a new feature in any product of any company is only about collecting and selling your data, and never about making something actually better.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago

Yep beware, any time a company you do business with sends you a letter saying something like,

"Good news! (Our old company name) is now (new company name)!"

You're about to get fucked.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 months ago

Oh, did GM just step in it this time. Being stupid and removing important features is one thing, but straight-up defamation like this is another.

Google and Apple’s lawyers must be salivating a river right now.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 months ago

They aren't wrong. Touch controls in a car are a nuisance.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

My car is a 2017 and its entertainment system hasn’t been update since then. I don’t want to pay the $250 to upgrade it or whatever the crazy price was.

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Lots of people gonna be dropping GM. I was a Chevy guy my whole life and I got a Tacoma about a year ago. It’s not even a premium model and the quality and reliability is miles above Chevrolet

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