this post was submitted on 28 Nov 2023
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politics

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[–] [email protected] 178 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Next, he’s going to say that he did repeat the oath, but he had his fingers crossed so it doesn’t count.

[–] [email protected] 96 points 11 months ago

The Narcissist's Prayer:

That didn't happen.
And if it did, it wasn't that bad.
And if it was, that's not a big deal.
And if it is, that's not my fault.
And if it was, I didn't mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 11 months ago

Damn. Well, you win this time, Mr Donald, but we'll get you in the end!

[–] [email protected] 121 points 11 months ago (3 children)
[–] [email protected] 96 points 11 months ago (5 children)

They are arguing that the oath doesn't include the word "support" not that he didn't take the oath. Not saying it's a good argument but that's what they are actually arguing.

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

Emphasis mine.

[–] [email protected] 96 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I feel like if that's your argument, you absolutely have no business being president.

[–] [email protected] 78 points 11 months ago

He didn't and doesn't.

[–] [email protected] 46 points 11 months ago (7 children)

I wonder what their definition of "support" is and how they plan on using that as a defense.

[–] [email protected] 35 points 11 months ago

Or what their definition of “defend” is, and how they plan to use that as support.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 11 months ago (6 children)

The judge also found that the "Office of President of the United States" was not an office of the United States... so yeah...

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (3 children)

It's the Air Bud loophole for fascists.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 11 months ago

I would much rather have a golden retriever as my president

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (7 children)

Their argument is that because he did not use the exact word "support" in respect to the Constitution, that he is not able to be excluded from holding office in the US even if he did commit seditious acts. He is saying that his oath to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution" is entirely different than an oath to "support" it. It's nonsense, but one judge (in Colorado, I believe?) ~~has already provided legitimacy to that argument, so... the stupid argument now has judicial precedent.~~

Edit: Correcting my mistake about the Judge's verdict. The judge did not uphold the argument that the Presidential oath was not to "support" the Constitution. Instead, the Judge was convinced by Trump's team that the President is not an "officer of the United States". Therefore, Trump took no oath as an Officer of the United States, and, thus, Section 3 of the 14th Amendment (which exclude someone who swore such an oath, who then incites an insurrection from holding federal or state office) simply doesn't apply to someone who has only sworn an oath as President.

[–] [email protected] 45 points 11 months ago (4 children)

That judge is insane. The word "officer" literally means "one who holds office". This has always been the dictionary definition of the word. What the fuck is that judge smoking?!

[–] [email protected] 21 points 11 months ago

He's smoking his fat bribes from the rich cunts that run the country.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago (3 children)

The fuck Simon Says argument is this? Are we in kindergarten?

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[–] [email protected] 94 points 11 months ago (4 children)

"Because the framers chose to define the group of people subject to Section Three by an oath to 'support' the Constitution of the United States, and not by an oath to 'preserve, protect and defend' the Constitution, the framers of the Fourteenth Amendment never intended for it to apply to the President," Blue wrote.

By the same token, the Second Amendment doesn't say "guns".

[–] [email protected] 52 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Every American has a right to have one of these:

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[–] [email protected] 79 points 11 months ago (2 children)

We're all dumber for having this guy around

[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago

Remember that a large portion of the country still rallies behind this person. It's a sad state of affairs.

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[–] [email protected] 76 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Republicans: “let’s vote for this guy”

[–] [email protected] 33 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I feel like the founders felt that the voting base would not possibly be dumb enough to support an individual like Trump. They put in appropriate guardrails but never thought such a large portion of the country would push so hard towards fascism.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Of course they didn't. They wrote all this assuming that wealthy white landowning men would continue to be the only ones who could vote. Populism was not something on their radar.

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[–] [email protected] 60 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

"I don't stand behind anything." - Trump in the oval office, 2017

So, yeah.

[–] [email protected] 50 points 11 months ago (9 children)

Yes, you did.We saw it. It was recorded. Stop lying, goddamn you.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 11 months ago (4 children)

The sophistry here is that the presidential oath doesn't contain the word "support". It's complete bullshit but you never know with this SCOTUS.

[–] [email protected] 39 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Not sure how support doesn't fall under "preserve, protect and defend" in every way that's meaningful

[–] [email protected] 29 points 11 months ago (1 children)

That is the sophistry part. It clearly was intended to be a higher level of oath that included the lower one. Watch: SCOTUS will say that the president actually doesn't have to support the Constitution.

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[–] [email protected] 48 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The argument that I've heard from some prominent lawyers is that "preserve, protect and defend" was intended by the framers to be a stronger oath than "support" and that it should be construed as including "support". Hopefully the courts agree with that reasoning.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 11 months ago (10 children)

Even if not stronger per se, surely if I said I was going to "protect" you, we would agree that I am "supporting" you. It's like saying I only promised to make you wealthier, not pay you. They are not literally the same word but paying someone is a way to make them wealthier.

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[–] [email protected] 46 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I can't comprehend how any American who calls himself a patriot can vote for this traitorous pig.

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[–] [email protected] 44 points 11 months ago

Bam. Perjury.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 11 months ago (15 children)

What a simpler time when we could all joke about Clinton arguing about the meaning of the word “is”.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 11 months ago

At least then we could argue about a lie being a lie, now it's all "he never said that (literally 4 seconds ago), if he did it's fine, if you're mad that's your fault, he never said it anyway. I like that he said it."

[–] [email protected] 25 points 11 months ago

thing about that is, clinton actually had a point. he said "there is nothing going on between [he and monica lewinsky]" when asked, and was then accused of perjury. He argued that "is" meant "is", and because at the time of asking he and lewinsky didn't have an ongoing relationship he didn't lie.

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Bullshit, traitor. Lock him up.

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[–] [email protected] 28 points 11 months ago

If the Founders wanted Presidents removed for committing Insurrection they would have EXPLICITLY stated it in the Constitution! Just like how the EXPLICITLY allow people to own AR15 guns and how it's EXPLICITLY allowed to shoot up schools with those guns!

[–] [email protected] 28 points 11 months ago

I hope we see this in the political ads next year

[–] [email protected] 21 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Harry & Lloyd, Laurel & Hardy, Trump & The Republican Party.

Not sure which one's the dumbest.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 11 months ago (3 children)

Oh, so he was never the president then? I can dig that.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago

It's cool guys, he crossed his toes before he took the stand so it didn't count.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago (2 children)

https://youtube.com/watch?v=ohgTEk9h1kc&t=36 wtf did I just watch then? Is this some weird DnD timeline, where you can roll to disbelieve?

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 11 months ago (4 children)

I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.

I mean, the word "support" doesn't appear there, although it's a stretch to say that "Preserve, protect, and defend" doesn't imply "support" also.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago

It says "to the best of my ability" and since he has no abilities, he has no responsibility to do anything.

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