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submitted 4 hours ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

On Earth, the cardinal directions are straightforward. The arrow on a compass points to the nearest magnetic pole. You can then use it to travel anywhere on Earth.

In space, the idea of anything being "central" enough to be used as a "North" (since the universe has no center) or being fixated enough to not somehow pose issues is more convoluted.

If you were a pioneer of space exploration, what would your "North" be?

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[-] [email protected] 13 points 3 hours ago

Center of gravity of the galactic cluster/supercluster

[-] [email protected] 10 points 3 hours ago

I’d use Discworld nomenclature:

  • Hubward
  • Rimward
  • Turnwise
  • Widdershins
[-] [email protected] 1 points 39 minutes ago

Fun fact, woddershins is a real word, it used to be used for talking about someone walking around a church counter clockwise, which would make it possible for a demon (or fae?) to snatch children up

[-] [email protected] 1 points 18 minutes ago

What about catywampus?

[-] [email protected] 16 points 4 hours ago

The Emperor's psychic beacon, of course.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 2 hours ago

I thought this was obvious

[-] [email protected] 2 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

The Astronomican.

The Emperor Protects.

[-] [email protected] 7 points 3 hours ago

::: spoiler It will be so much more complicated than "North" IMO. We will use something like XNAV. It becomes a measure of time as much as any measure of location, along with a measure of relative gravity.

I don't think space exploration in the current culturally adolescent fantasy of a naval voyage type of experience will ever happen. I believe we will traverse the stars, but it will be long after most of humanity lives in O'Neill cylinder like space habits, primarily in cislunar space. The big shift will come after we have effective infrastructure to access the vast resource wealth, first in near Earth objects, then in other small bodies such as Ceres if it is fully solidified, or other planetesimal cores that are accessible. Gravitational differentiation of heavy elements sequesters almost all of Earth's resources. We are fighting over the scraps of a billion years or so of smaller collisions on the skin of Earth that happened to remain accessible, and did not get subducted by plate tectonics or buried too deeply to access. Undifferentiated bodies from the early stellar formation should be much more abundant in mineral wealth, and a planetesimal core, should absolutely dwarf most mineral wealth humans have ever scavenged.

Once we get to this stage, I don't think we will leave until Sol starts causing problems that harken a coming distant end to Sol. At that point, I believe we will build a massive infrastructure to produce antimatter in quantity and generation ships for one way travel.

In that scenario, navigation in a human sense is largely irrelevant. When we are interstellar travelers, the destination will be our guiding star. I believe we will likely also create something like kilometers scale self replicating systems for resource acquisition and processing. These will need to navigate within a stellar system. For those use cases, maybe they would use something like XNAV as a backup, but they would likely use two way communications beacons with something like an all talk and listen all the time type of management. I think this kind of communication will likely be critical for all human colonies as well to ensure cultural unity. I don't think we will ever travel the stars. Space is far too vast. I think FTL or even a substantial percentage of it is pure fantasy. One of our biggest issues with the concept is that we call it FTL. Light is not relevant here, it is just a shortcut term that is not relevant to the real issue of the Speed of Causality. Light can travel at the SoC, but the SoC has no inherent need for or relationship to light as a fundamental property. If no photons are present the SoC marches on.

I view the present sci-fi navel drama trope like the naïveté of 15th century Europeans saying "We'll just sail around the world backwards for a new trade route to India." Reality is far more complicated and beyond the scope of anything these leaders imagined possible. ...but that is my $2 comment when you only asked for $0.02. I really like the subject of futurism, and like to expand upon the abstracted ideas. I'm certainly no expert. This is part of a creative writing hobby project and I'm always open to adding complexity or changes with new information.

[-] [email protected] 4 points 3 hours ago

I think FTL or even a substantial percentage of it is pure fantasy.

I used to think FTL was nonsense, but it turns out the universe has a built-in mechanism for time travel at the Planck scale. Particles smaller than the atom swing both ways when it comes to causality and retrocausality.

Now I think that either FTL is completely impossible at the macro scale or it'll be so easy we'll be embarrassed we didn't have it sooner.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

If we're talking intergalactic navigation, I'd use QSO J0529-4351 as north.

It has the highest chance of being visible from wherever we want to go.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 3 hours ago

I was going to suggest the Great Attractor or the Shapley Supercluster, but I think your suggestion is better. It's more point-like and since it's farther away (well outside of the reachable universe) it results in a more uniform set of directions over long distances.

Of course, cultural influence will be big. If these explorers are Terragen then most likely the Milky Way's north/south direction will be pretty deeply ingrained in their coordinate systems. They might keep on using that, since it's not like manual astrolabe-style navigation will ever be relevant at that level of technology.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 4 hours ago

Earth, obviously. Or rather, where we think we left it...

[-] [email protected] 2 points 3 hours ago

By the time intergalactic navigation is relevant we'll have likely dismantled Earth. The vast majority of it is just sitting there generating gravity, a huge waste of its potential.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 23 minutes ago* (last edited 23 minutes ago)

Collapse imminent in minus 3 minutes. Please vacate floor 14839.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 3 hours ago

We could assign it to any point within a recognizable region in the Cosmic Microwave Background, which would probably be the most universally-applicable reference available. One just needs to be able to filter out the noise from surrounding celestial bodies. The CMB does slowly change over time, but so too does the position of stars within galaxies and galaxies relative to one another.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

Might be a bit simple but why not the "North Star" (Polaris)? Navigation could work via analysis of stars positions relative to eachother/positions of constellations relative to the ship. You could justify it in-universe as being a nod to how early mariners used these same stars to navigate Earth's oceans.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago

Point it towards Earth, or if that's impossible with future space magic, towards the largest gravity well, i.e. center of the local galaxy or nearest dense object.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago

Probably arbitrarily one of the two vectors perpendicular to the plane of the Milky Way? (Assuming it wasn't necessary for this navigation system to work outside of our galaxy.)

[-] [email protected] 2 points 4 hours ago
[-] [email protected] 3 points 4 hours ago

planetary, planetary, intergalactic

But seriously, even so, I think it'd be reasonable to still have per-galaxy navigation systems.

this post was submitted on 23 Sep 2024
21 points (95.7% liked)

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