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At least Biden still feel the need to pander to the LGBT community and other minorities, which means he can still be made to compromise on certain issues. With Trump it’s straight up fascism.
Just on this reasoning alone, Biden’s got my vote, considering that Trump will still do the genocide anyway, if not worse.
I don’t understand why Hexbears think that voting for Biden means supporting his policies. It is entirely possible to strategically vote to protect the lives of minorities from being endangered. If we can buy 4 more years of time to organize while protecting minority lives, then that’s a bargain I am willing to make, no matter how repulsive Biden’s genocide is to me. I don’t understand the willingness to gamble with accelerationism.
The American electoral system is designed to punish those who do not toe the line, so we’re only going to get punished if we do not at least pretend to “play by the rules”. There is nothing you can do to change that except for a revolution, and until we have the strength and numbers to do so, we have to play by the rules. If Trump wins, then any socialist project is dead in the water.
(Note: I am not American so I can’t actually vote, but you get the point.)
Not a great bit tbh
Except voting for Biden is not strategically voting "to protect the lives of minorities from being endangered" considering the fact Biden has Trump beat on deportations, police funding, prosecution of minority protest/civil rights groups; and normalizing genocide by VOTING for the man who is committing it definitely doesn't protect Muslims and Arabs,
Who's left, queer people who he left to the right-wing mass harassment wolves during the last four years because he was comfortably in power? Like these are basic facts the bluemagas refuse to digest
Your failure of analysis lies in the fact you don't recognize that Biden is the accelertionist candidate, while Trump's incompetence, unpopularity and animosity he receives from the democratic wing of capital is the far safer bet in terms of harm reduction
Right now capital is united, with Trump in office Dems are gonna have an impossible task of going along with him after the apocalyptic anti-trump narrative they've seeded the media with, it's in that disconnect just like after 2016 the new left can actually grow and organize
It's easier to oppose Trump than Biden, and for that reason alone minorities like me want to see the dems eat shit
Are you fucking serious
Voting is simultaneously meaningless and says nothing but at the same time u really for reals gotta be doing it pls
For the revleft participation in the system is endorsement of it.
You can't tell people to vote in one election and then tell people that actually it needs to be overthrown and think that's going to happen 5 years later.
At some point or another you just have to commit to it being broken and build your movement based entirely on the fact that it is broken and can not be supported in any way whatsoever.
You are not convincing anyone that there is a need for revolution by telling them that actually there is a reason to participate in the system that you want revolution against. Maybe that passes among very well educated theory-heads but it does not work when you exit theory spaces and start talking to the masses.
Why even write all that then?
The global hegemon's shitty politics affects everyone.
As I said in my comment, I don’t understand why people are so adamant about not voting for Biden.
For me (perhaps coming from a Chinese perspective, although I can’t speak for everyone), it’s a no brainer: play with the cards you’re dealt with, think about how to win the long game etc. It’s all about being strategic, and how to buy time and build an actual movement from under an oppressive regime. Moralizing about it is not going win you the war. And I want us to win in the end.
For example, the CPC cooperated with the KMT to form a national front against fascist Japan, even though the KMT had massacred some 95% of the communist party members during the Long March. It was not something to feel good about, even with great humiliation, but it was necessary for the communist movement to survive and ultimately prevail.
I don’t know if I should say this, but it is becoming quite clear to me that Western leftists are more interested in moralizing the issues than to actually build a revolutionary movement. Perhaps this is why there are so few left wing movements left in the Western imperial core? I don’t think they actually want to win and take power. I’m not saying this is the main problem, but certainly worth thinking more about it.
damn i wonder if it has anything to do with the genocide he's doing
Death to America
There you are moralizing, just like Kaplya said.
"Being opposed to an ongoing genocide is just moralizing. Also you should listen to my other opinions on morality."
I can excuse genocide, but I draw the line at refusing to make token gestures that don't materially help marginalized folks.
Ok this doesn't make any sense in the context of voting for Biden and the Democratic Party, the left will NEVER win voting for the dems which should be clear to anyone who's been alive these last forty years
Biden's victory in 2020 obliterated the American left and the Sanders movement that gave it steam, ironically the only one moralizing here is the person demanding we vote for a genocider because Trump will hypothetically be worse or god forbid "unpredictable"
I am more than comfortable throwing the democratic party in front of the Republican bus and buying the left time to properly organize without the disgusting kayfabe of the DNC splitting our movement, if the dems are serious about their opposition to Trump than they will be forced to split the establishment and weaken the imperial structure overall and if they're just bullshitting and will happily go along with Trump's fascism then the swathes of radicalized youth that will create will aid our movement too
Either way that is far more strategic than making deranged ahistorical comparisons with the CPC's relationship with the KMT during the Sino-Japanese War
There is no socialist project to become dead in the water. What is possible is the project of Palestinian liberation, and THAT is being actively exterminated by Biden. You are fucking ghoulish to think of 4 more years of this as "4 more years of time to organize while protecting minority lives" while he literally exterminated Palestinians. Are they being protected right now while we bomb them?
Those of us with humanity are already getting punished, it doesn't matter if you play by the rules. And again Palestinians are wiped out while you are concerned with playing by the rules.
You have no use to any movement leftward if you are willing to sacrifice the Palestinians "strategically", you are nothing but another second international offering up other people on a platter. Your "bargain" makes you the enemy of socialists just as much as a republican. Go bathe in Arab blood or whatever you do for fun, we want no part in it
I thought your point through all your posts here on Hexbear dot net is that Biden is a much more ruthless fascist than Trump.. Like you can't say:
and
Which is it? So, with Trump the US is going to be a fascist but not full-blown white supremacist state while with Biden the US will be full-blown white supremacist but not fascist.
Or is this just you doing a bit for your own amusement?
If Biden was some feckless loser who just kept bumbling around the White House as a well meaning but ineffective in stopping the fascism the USA is based on/infected with, you'd probably be able to make a "critical support" argument to vote for Mr. Magoo to the Hexbear crowd. But this goes beyond anything that could justifiably be argued as "critical support".
Joe and the dems could pass a voting rights act to protect minority voting rights, just like they could protect abortion rights. What minority lives will they be protecting? They're doing urban warfare centers in every major region, and libs are apparently very comfortable with whole sale slaughter of non white people. It's looking more and more as if Genocide Joe is the more effective evil...
We are supposed to have a "representational democracy" where 'elected' officials represent the will of the people. Votes are consent. Consent is support. Holding your nose is consent.
no matter who fear mongering is part of Manufacturing Consent.
The ruling class doen't need to give concessions knowing Manufactured Consent methods will keep them in power. They do not care if you consent gleefully or with distain. Consent is consent.
Voting for Biden or Trump is to maintain consent for the establishment. Voting outside the establishment is a non consent vote. It doesn't need to win, but a large enough faction where the Winston Smiths
can't fudge to hide such as the
vote.
They had to cover it. They had to factor it. Maybe not winning the war against....war but it embarassed the establishment. Clearly showing they do not represent us with their actions, and more importantly the World at large there is a reaistance movement to what bullshit our leaders are comitting. That not all
wants this and it wasn't just "the Arab population" it was across the board and across demographics.
Ok but we have to know if we have the numbers and we're never going to know that if we vote for Democrats every year. Counting our numbers is critical and worth way more than voting for either fascist party.
Every time a Democrat is elected without being held to task to follow through on a progressive platform, the Democratic party slips to the right. Hillary was always well to the right of Obama. Biden is well to the right of Hillary.
What looks like "pandering", if you examine it past the most superficial performative level, is a race to the bottom.
In a swing state maybe it makes sense, but 75% of the population does not live in a swing state.
Nice try Vaushite shill, I am immune to your pedo power
Pretending to care about something does not mean he can be made to compromise on the issue, he and the dems will pretend to stand for something and then conveniently fail to pass or compromise away everything worthwhile until it's exactly the bill Republicans would have wanted anyway
Don't use LGBTQ people as a rhetorical shield to vote for a genocider.