I said do you speak my language
He just smiled and gave me a genocide sandwich
this post was submitted on 15 Oct 2023
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Kangaroo
Add it to our list of embarrassingly backwards decisions as a country.
What's depressing is that they lost to a “If you don’t know, vote No” slogan:
During months of campaigning, the No vote gained momentum with slogans that appealed to voter apathy – “If you don’t know, vote No” – and a host of other statements designed to instil fear, according to experts, including that it would divide Australia by race and be legally risky
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The proposal, to recognize Indigenous people in the constitution and create an Indigenous body to advise government on policies that affect them, needed a majority nationally and in four of six states to pass.
Jeez
The text of the proposed constitutional amendment can be found here. The entire extent of its "recognition" was to create a body that can make presentations to Parliament.
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Most Australian thing ever. Im.not surprised in the slightest
This is a very deceptive headline a majority of australians support the idea of a reccomandary body for indiginouse peoples (the voice what was proposed). However, the reason i beleive it failed is because it would have direcrly made a devision of race within our constitution. I would define any devision of race regardless of purpose as textbook racism but i seem to get a lot of pushback from such an idea. I think the thing that ultumatly caused it to fail was not the concept but the unesaasary implementation within the constitution.
Solving systemic racial injustice is an inherently one sided thing, and that isn't racist or divisive.
What is racist and divisive is allowing the traditional owners of the land to be trapped in perpetual poverty, with significantly shorter lives and with next to no hope of help. Setting up something to address an imbalance like this, to bring actual equality, is not racist.
There's a fairly well known saying "when you're accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression." Things aren't getting worse for you, we're just trying to pull other people out of a hole so they can stand beside you.
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There have been a dozen or so advisory bodies since the 60s and most of the time they're been disassembled when the following party gains controll of parliament. The only thing that would have changed would be to protect the body from being dissolved without another referendum, that's it... All these people that have a problem with the voice probably have nfi these bodies already exist and have never been concerned with any recommendations they've made.
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Yeah, I was reading about this in another thread and as I understand it this "advisory council" would have no actual authority, it would just hold meetings and make suggestions to lawmakers who could then take it or leave it. Left me with no idea why something like that needs to be in the constitution of a country. Just pass a law establishing it.
Because laws can be repealed ? The purpose was to make it binding so there was always a indigenous body, unlike all of the previous bodies that cease to exist with change in government. Granted none were legislated I don't believe
According to the text of the amendment laws would have to be passed to set the body's "composition, functions, powers and procedures" anyway.
I'm not saying this body would be a bad thing, I'm just unable to see why it needs to be in the constitution itself. The failure of the referendum doesn't seem like it really impacts anything.
Your suggestion has been tried repeatedly and the moment the right-wing have the power needed to tear it down, that's what they do.
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The answer to that lies within the question: why put anything in a constitution? Why have a constitution?
Anything could be made using laws or rules. And anyone can then undo and rewrite them.
It's because countries generally need a foundational document outlining how government will operate, and how laws will be made, and what the country stands for. And have the stability and security of knowing that those operating principles can't be easily changed.
So the idea was, by incorporating the Voice within the constitution, you recognise indigenous Australians in your foundational document as having the right to have a recognised voice on what concerns them, and having unique aspects of history, and historical treatment, that make that appropriate.
Not a right to dismiss laws, or change them. Not a right to create laws. Not a right to ignore laws, or amend proposals. Just to have a recognised voice on issues affecting them, and ask the "lawmakers" to do any of the above.
This is important, because yes, you don't want to enshrine anything that gives a small proportion of the population the ability to sidestep the legislative and political process.
But as a country, we do want to enshrine a means by which indigenous Australians, - a historically extremely disadvantaged group of people, who form less than 4% of the population, and don't have the financial or organisational means to engage expensive political lobby firms like large corporations and mining companies- can participate more directly with the political process of laws affecting them, and therefore feel symbolically "seen".
An analogy: If a public company wanted to create a Disability and Equity officer position, and wanted that position enshrined in the company charter to show the public that: the company was really serious about that position; provide good PR; signal to the public the company's values; and protect it from being included in future job cuts, or made redundant in future for economic or ideological reasons under a different CEO, they would present shareholders with the question and put it to a vote.
The company would not include within that question, details about how much that position would be paid. Or what room of what building they would work in. Or how they would communicate. Or what restrictions would be put on the position. Or how candidates would be interviewed, assessed, and hired.
Shareholders would just see something like: "The company resolves to include the position of Disability and Equity Officer in the company charter, as an indication of the company's desire that it become a more inclusive workplace, and to signal those values to the general public."
Because while you want people to know the position is permanent, you also want to leave the nitty gritty details to being guided by other processes, so that they can be changed more flexibly then once a year or more at a General Meeting of all shareholders
Unfortunately those words are largely wasted IMO. If you read the text of the constitutional amendment itself you'll note that the constitution itself would have only established the existence of the council. Every other detail of it is left up to legislation:
the Parliament shall, subject to this Constitution, have power to make laws with respect to matters relating to the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice, including its composition, functions, powers and procedures.”
So again, why is this in the constitution? The Parliament could neuter it on a whim by passing a law at any point that established its composition is one guy and its sole function is to publish a pamphlet for sale in the Parliament gift shop. It wouldn't make much difference if they could simply abolish it.
Because even with that additional wording was in the constitution, any law or changes that prevented the Voice from existing, and being able to make representations to Parliament, would be unconstitutional.
Alright, its sole function is to present that pamphlet to Parliament itself. Still pointless.
Not pointless at at all, and I'm not sure why you believe that.
Do you think mining companies and large corporations spend the 100s of millions of dollars they do on political lobbyists, to approach parliament and put forward the companies' views on their behalf, if it was pointless?
No. Lobbyists achieve results, and at a minimum, make the companies feel like they're part of the political process, and that their concerns and needs are being voiced, and a much healthier chance of having proposed legislation amended due to that lobbying. It's political participation.
Lobbyist don't get to change laws either. They don't get to amend or dismiss laws, or sidestep the political process. They communicate and voice their concerns to those that do have that ability. I don't see anyone saying lobbyists are useless pamphlet sellers.
The Voice was essentially a proposal to enable the creation of a constitutionally recognised lobbying entity that would work on Indigenous Australians' behalf, since Indigenous Australians don't have the financial or organisational capacity to create such an entity themselves, and
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This is why they should have a explain in your own words why you are voting this way on referendums
Because it gives a lot more feedback than the binary yes or no option
Solicit feedback, definitely - but soliciting that feedback in the moment that people are voting on the constitutional amendment that would implement that feedback is a little late, no?
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That was the concerning part. Defining, very permanently, a group of people from all the others based on race. That's literally anti-equality.
Be well, but be better, my guy.
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