Fuck everything about this.
this post was submitted on 26 Dec 2024
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And Israel bombed Kamal Adwan Hospital again last night, murdering five of the hospital workers there.
Please note that Egypt is 100% complicit in Israel's genocide. They could have let many of these people out before Israel got to the Egyptian border and they didn't. They knew what would happen... but then they've never allowed the Palestinians who have lived there for decades to have citizenship.
I really think we need to start pointing fingers at who has been helping Israel in this beyond the U.S. and Europe.
Nobody mentioned Egypt but they are responsible because they would not partake in Israel's ethnic cleansing campaign? That is a wild take.
I didn't say they were responsible. They are complicit, not responsible, because they refused to open the border and let people flee and now there are babies dying from hypothermia in Gaza.
So in this case, maybe they should be mentioned since, again, this is due in part to their giving Israel free reign to slaughter. These babies could have lived if Israel did not start their genocide, but there's also a smaller possibility they could have lived if Egypt hadn't refused to let any Palestinians out, even after the slaughter began.
Egypt could have let every pregnant woman and child out of Gaza and they refused.
Babies are dying from Hypothermia because Israel is murdering them.
Egypt is in no way responsible for any of Israel's crimes. In fact it is good they kept their border closed instead of rewarding Israel's terrorism and genocide with free Gazan land by expelling all the Palestinians from it.
Why do you keep claiming I am saying "responsible" when I am saying "complicit?"
In fact it is good they kept their border closed instead of rewarding Israel’s terrorism and genocide with free Gazan land by expelling all the Palestinians from it.
What the fuck... It's good they didn't let pregnant women and children through their border and allowed Israel to slaughter them?
The goal of Israel's genocide is to expell Palestinians and steal their land. This terrorism is how Israel was founded and is how it has always expanded
Not abetting in the ethnic cleansing is the opposite of complicity.
There are many other flaws in your argument. You speak like men have no value and only women and children should be saved. We would be hearing stories about the 100% terrorist kill count if only men were left.
Finally, this is not the 1800s. We have boats. Israel was begging many countries to help their ethnic cleansing. Every country could have abetted in the ethnic cleansing if they wished for it. Egypt bordering Palestine is of little relevance in the modern age. It only makes for a convenient narrative.
You keep lying about what I say in order to argue with me and I don't understand why.
There are no lies. Gaza has hospitals to treat patients. Israel bombed them. This is not the responsibility of Egypt. Medical personnel and medical equipment is waiting right at the border of Gaza, all blocked by Israel.
What you are arguing for is because Israel commits acts of terrorism it becomes Egypts responsibility to save those victims. In the short term this would be good. But it does not solve the issue. In a few years Israel would invade Egypt and ethnically cleanse more.
Only by forcing Israel's hand have Americans finally woken up to what Israel truly is. Israel will kill pregnant women and children to steal their land.
These kids did not die from lack of hospital but lack of house. Stop blaming parties which did not partake in the genocide. The head responsible parties are Israel, America, UK and Germany.
This luckily did not happen. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/2/16/satellite-photos-show-egypt-building-gaza-buffer-zone-as-rafah-push-looms
There are absolutely lies. You have lied more than once. You claimed I said Egypt was responsible. I did not. You said it again after I told you I did not say Egypt was responsible. You then claimed I said they should have let women and children out. I did not.
I said Egypt was culpable, which is not the same as responsible, and I said that they should have let pregnant women (and children) out, not all women.
Stop lying about what I said and maybe we can discuss this. I doubt you will though. I doubt you'll even acknowledge that you lied about what I said. Please do surprise me.
Complicity is a higher form of responsibility. When someone drowns you can be indirectly responsible to save them. But when you are complicit in drowning someone you are directly responsible for their death.
Similarly you should be glad I used a lesser term of "responsible" than the extreme accusation of complicity you used. Resorting to semantical discussions will not save your non sequitur blaming Egypt.
Your arguments about pregnant women are all invalid and appeal to some cherry picked feel good emotion while ignoring non pregnant women and men suffering from the same genocide. Once again, field hospitals and medics are waiting right outside the border which Israel now fully cut off from Egypt.
The only complicity Egypt has is not fighting Israel for violating the agreement on the Rafah border.
As I thought, you wouldn't bother owning up to the fact that you lied about what I said directly back to me. And yet you think I'll discuss this with you anyway. Is there any reason I shouldn't just give up, report you for trolling and walk away at this point?
This abuts with the "right of return" arguments. If Palestinians were allowed to leave, would Israel permit them to return to the Gaza Strip, or would the front of Palestinian resistance instead shift to Egypt's border?
I know where my money is, but...
No it doesn't. This is an emergency. It's a genocide.
And maybe let Palestinians decide whether or not they want to risk not having a right of return vs. dying rather than have Egypt decide it for them?
Would you argue that Native Americans shouldn't have been allowed sanctuary in some city during the Trail of Tears because if they accept sanctuary, they might not get their land back?
It is an emergency, but will the next one be on Egypt's border, or Gaza's is the question they seem to be asking.
Palestinians seem to have had no say up to this point, why change course now? I know why, but it's mighty inconvenient for any powers that be.
Finally, Your Trail of Tears analogy is really strained. As far as I know there was (and still is) no hope of tribes getting their land back, the tribes had a designated "indian territories" they were being relegated to. as opposed to the Palestinians who have the destination of "not here".
When has there ever been a refugee situation where the world accepted those refugees were fairly removed from their land and should give up hope of getting it back?
This is some sort of weird "finders keepers" playground rule that doesn't exist in the real world.
Would you stand on a border and refuse to let a child through because one day they might get their land back if they aren't murdered first? Does that really make sense to you?
The case of the Palestinians now pretty neatly fits into "give up the chance of ever getting back"
No, individuals having to watch this on the border have it rough and the entire situation is shit, but Cairo playing realpolitik on the matter of refugees is not something I can reasonably fault them for: they are elected to prioritize Egypt's interest, and allowing a group that may reasonably become a southern Hezbollah is in direct conflict with that mission.
Allowing mothers and children is the human thing to do, but with no actionable plan to return them, they become a liability with a fuse of some 16-20 years.
Now you're arguing that Egypt shouldn't have let them out because they would have no chance of getting back what they aren't going to get back anyway.
Allowing mothers and children is the human thing to do, but
The fact that you think there should be a 'but' after that does not speak highly of you.
I'm arguing (and have been) that Egypt is looking out for Egypt only. Allowing Palestinian refugees introduces a possible liability for the Egyptian government to deal with down the line.
You're right. I'm a monster for allowing myself to try and rationalize the actions of a government instead of assuming all they do comes from a place of humanity.
Governments are not people, they do not act as such. At best they are corporations with the endgoal of "stay in power" instead of shareholder value.