this post was submitted on 04 Nov 2023
534 points (92.9% liked)
The memes of the climate
1650 readers
1 users here now
The climate of the memes of the climate!
Planet is on fire!
mod notice: do not hesitate to report abusive comments, I am not always here.
rules:
-
no slurs, be polite
-
don't give an excuse to pollute
-
no climate denial
-
and of course: no racism, no homophobia, no antisemitism, no islamophobia, no transphobia
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Yeah, I can imagine that. Tobacco companies have been selling better smoking (first, electric cigarettes, then vapes) for decades.
Without control, companies will always want to sell more
Vaping is actually very helpful and it's probably helped a lot of people stop smoking.
The only problem was the fact that they got away with doing shit like advertising it to kids and making it cool. Fix that problem and vaping is almost literally only an advantage compared to cigarettes.
And even with more people taking it up, it's still unhealthy but it's like mildly unhealthy instead of cigarettes where it's like oh yeah you're going to double your chance of dying at 50.
Vaping is an advantage compared to cigarettes sure, but it is still signifcantly worse than just breathing air and it still promotes consuming one of the most addictive substances, nicotine. It drains the health and wealth of its consumers and offers little more than a head rush and a habit in return.
For the vast majority of smokers it's not a choice between vaping and air, it's a choice between vaping and cigarettes.
Tell that to the kids getting hooked by candy vapes.
Those are mostly banned now, so they're a non issue going forward.
"Mostly," "now," "going forward." As if that makes it somehow okay?!
No motherfucking excuses for vaping can make up for the grievous harm that's already been done.
^this
Yeah, but who gives a flying fuck about smokers?
Smokers' needs are way, way the fuck down the priorities list compared to non-smokers' needs. If something might save 100 smokers but risk harming a single non-smoker, it's still not worth doing.
And if smokers don't like it, well, it's their own damn fault for making that choice. Quit fucking cold-turkey and deal with it.
Edit: vapes do harm by tempting non-smokers to start vaping. If you want help quitting smoking, at least use a goddamn nicotine patch or whatever like a responsible person instead of being a useful idiot enabling Philip Morris etc. to push new shit on the public. Everybody defending vaping because it's myopically good only for people who already smoke (ignoring the significant harm that new, non-smokers get addicted to it) is a terrible fucking person and should be ashamed of himself.
Their kids
Their family
Their workplace.
Their neighbors
Do you know what an addiction is?
Do you know what "creating new addicts by pushing vaping on them" is?!
Why the fuck do you think existing addicts are somehow entitled to expose others to risk and temptation just because they're too fucking weak to make good decisions for themselves?!
Addiction is a powerful thing and this kind of thinking is such a counter-intuitive way of dealing with it.
Addiction often stems from issues people are dealing with in their lives and telling them to stop like this as if it's a moral failure on their part just feeds into it all. Most people know they need to stop for themselves and others but shoving them down like this genuinely makes it harder
The point is that smokers do not deserve that help AT THE COST OF NEW NON-SMOKERS GETTING ADDICTED TO VAPING!
Cause that's the trade-off you're making when you talk about how great vapes are. NOT helping smokers at no cost to anybody else, but instead helping smokers at very high cost to the rest of society.
If you want to quit smoking, use a goddamn PATCH or something that
UNLIKE MOTHERFUCKING VAPES -- actually doesn't tempt stupid teenagers to start the same habit you're trying to break!
Being marginally less unhelpful than some other very unhelpful thing is still objectively unhelpful.
Marginally is a massive understatement. Maybe in 50 years we're going to discover that it causes some crazy side effects, but in comparison to smoking it's like having a hamburger once a week compared to three a day.
The point is, its amount of helpfulness is still negative, not positive.
For someone who is a smoker and otherwise would not be able to quit its helpfulness as immensely positive.
For every smoker vaping helps, it also tempts probably at least one person to start using who didn't before. Therefore, it is 1000% indisputably negative and everybody trying to make excuses for it is a goddamn enabler.
For every person who makes up bs statistics, there's a 1000% increase in the number of sad kittens. It's indisputably negative.
But that’s not even remotely true…
It is extremely 1000% true that vapes ARE IN FACT A NEGATIVE for TEMPTING NON-SMOKERS TO START VAPING.
Now quit lying!
95% harm reduction means 5% harm is left, by fucking definition!
Yeah don't let perfect be the enemy of good etc.
Because Lemmy has a relatively small user base bad takes can take up a lot of a thread. Normally those silly voices would be hidden away. By replying to them lots we let them take up more of the thread space. I'm guilty of it too, but after scrolling down I think we should just ignore that person.
First the cigarette itself was marketed as better than rolling your own. Next came filters, so called "light" and "ultralight" versions of existing products, electric cigs, then finally vapes.
vaping isn't smoking, nicotine isn't a carcinogen, it's all the additives and the actual fire which cause cancer, other than that, brilliant analogy
Imagine if we ran out of war. All those jobs in the military and the military industrial complex!