this post was submitted on 15 Aug 2023
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TIL you have to endorse letting the Ukrainians fall to fascist imperialism to be on the left
All US aid to ukraine is doing is making the war longer and bloodier. Have you seen what Ukraine has been bombing? It's apartment buildings, gas stations and civilians. (Russia isn't better on that front, they bombed a literal kindergarten this week). If this war keeps up, all of Ukraine and Southern Russia will end up like Bakhmut. US aid isn't enough to win, only to continue the bloodshed.
What's the actual genuine alternative then where Ukraine doesn't have to fight to free it's territory from Russia? A ceasefire is worthless as Russia will build up forces again and just attack, trying to set out what it tried to do for years, take Ukraine under Russian control. And then people such as yourselves will then be criticising Ukraine and the west again when they put up another fight. Ukraine can't win in your eyes.
I've been following the war since February last year and it's been day after day after day of Russians explicitly targeting civilians, literally machine gunning them down in the streets, shooting at cars with tanks, raping and murdering them, targeted rocket attacks at hospitals, apartment blocks, places where people are trying to seek refuge from the war, stealing Ukrainian children and sending them to Russia, the list just goes on and on. There maybe unfortunate collateral damage from Ukrainian forces, there always is sadly in any war, but it's highly unlikely that Ukraine are targeting the very people they're trying to liberate.
That's a strong argument for the US to drastically increase its aid or even get involved to end the war very quickly. The US and its allies would very likely have the war over within weeks if not literally days. That would be a win win right? No more bloodshed like you said. No more hundreds of Ukrainian or Russian soldiers lives wasted. Ukraine gets it's territory back. The genocidal Russian imperialists get pushed back to their own borders.
You're working from a number of false premises - Like the people in the DPR and LPR don't want to be part of Ukraine, because the Galacian fascists who control the government in Kiev won't stop trying to kill them. What about the self-determination of people not to be slaughtered by Banderite fascist death squads? What about the self-determinations of Crimeans to finally break with Ukraine after trying for thirty years? Ahh, you will say, but those elections weren't real, so I can say that no one in any of those regions actually wants to be free of the violence directed at them by hte Rada.
ANd I could go on and on and on but you know what the truth is and you know I'm a lying tankie and blah blah blah we've all done this dance before.
Ukraine is winning the war, fash.
Just like they won back Bakhmut.
Also, you are the one backing the US above every single socialist project. You are the one who tolerates imperialism because it's blue. You are the one bothsidesing leftists and fascists. Every single one of your accusations is a confession.
Bakhmut was a unequivocal Ukranian victory, what are you talking about?
Ok fash
You tell these commies bro, our hero Zeleksny has already sworn to led the white race to victory
Nice cope
TIL you have to endorse letting the Ukrainians ethically cleanse the Donbass and Crimea to be on the left
No no, we want NATO out of Ukraine
And damn what the Ukrainians want!
"the Ukrainians" are not a monolith. You may be aware that a civil war raged for 8 years before Russia invaded?
"The Ukranians, they yearn for the trenches."