this post was submitted on 16 May 2024
236 points (98.4% liked)

World News

32501 readers
817 users here now

News from around the world!

Rules:

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] -2 points 7 months ago (2 children)

The popular view of Israel is as a modern state created with the backing of powerful western allies. This may be true of the current iteration of the state of Israel but the history is much older.

Jews have been living in Israel for thousands of years dating back to the Iron Age Kingdom of Israel, though for much of the intervening time the area was called Palestine (or other names). Owing to its long history of conquests and migration, many Jews left Palestine and migrated throughout Europe, forming diaspora communities (and frequently subject to antisemitism and violent pogroms).

Back in the 1500s the Ottoman Empire conquered Palestine and considered it part of Ottoman Syria. This lasted for centuries until the fall of the Ottoman Empire.

What Zionists want is the same thing that Palestinians want and the same thing that Chinese people already have (and Japanese and Korean and many other groups have): a homeland. Zionism as an idea goes back centuries, to the original departure of Jews and forming diaspora communities. The conflicts between Jews and other groups in Palestine (including Christians who migrated there in the Middle Ages) goes back centuries.

The main difference now is that Israel has an enormous amount of power due to their alliance with the UK and the US. The US in particular has a sizeable Jewish diaspora community that grew dramatically during the Holocaust. The cities of New York and Los Angeles are home to sizeable and highly influential Jewish communities, and many Hollywood executives, producers, actors, and comedians are Jewish. Jewish culture therefore forms a very substantial part of American culture (through TV shows like Seinfeld and Curb Your Enthusiasm and many movies) and many American non-Jews are politically friendly to the Zionist cause.

I, personally, don’t have a stake in the outcome. I want the violence to stop but I have no idea how that’s going to happen. The most recent conflict really has been going on for over a century. At one time even Nazi Germany had a side in it, supporting Arabic Palestinians. There have been many pogroms and genocides over the centuries, targeting both Jews and other groups. The Ottoman Empire committed genocides as well. It’s horrific but it’s so difficult to imagine a scenario where it will stop.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

I wish people would explain their downvotes for this post. It has more information and nuance than 99% of the posts on lemmy. I guess because it doesn't fit whatever rage they are currently entertaining.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Nuance isn't required here. Zionists want a theocratic apartheid state, Palestinians want a multi-ethnic, multi-religious state.

It's not Hamas bombing churches in Gaza. It wasn't Hamas who bombed Bethlehem and burned down the Christmas tree on Christmas Eve.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 7 months ago
[–] [email protected] -1 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Indeed, I don't know how to stop it either. If saving the Palestinians leads to another massacre of Jews, then as a proverb says, "An eye for an eye leaves everyone blind." “冤冤相报何时了。”It will only result in more bloodshed and cries of anguish. The Chinese government has consistently supported the 1967 two-state solution; I have seen this mentioned many times in official news. Perhaps what we need is an "Israeli-Palestinian Mandela." 😢

[–] [email protected] 0 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

A 2 state solution was never realistic. Throwing out unworkable peace solutions or quibbling over details instead of outright saying they're not ready for peace so that they can continue violence is a US (and israeli) tactic you'll see over and over.

The US and Israel both knew Palestine was never gonna give up its best land to hostile invaders, as the borders would make their economy entirely dependent on Israel, and Israel media made it very clear that such a state would only be temporary.