this post was submitted on 19 Nov 2024

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215

"We" didn't vote for this (lemmy.ml)

submitted 6 days ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

72 comments fedilink hide all child comments

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/22680392

Thinking of red states vs blue states is busted. Plenty of good visualizations of this over the years, but this election in particular feels really important to point out "We" did not chose this.

When I say we I mean registered US voters, but even less so citizens, and even less so again residents.

Even of the voters who did vote for the GOP candidate, who can say how many really wanted him or his policies vs they just didn't want more of the status quo Dems.

The popular vote tallies in this graphic are out of date too, He definitely didn't win in a landslide the way it can appear with red and blue maps. His win in the popular vote was also pretty small now that more votes have been counted. https://www.thenation.com/.../donald-trump-vote-margin.../

So, what if Biden used broad immunity SCOTUS granted to declare a crisis of democracy - That between massive disinformation campaigns by enemies both foreign and domestic, voter suppression, as well as many other factors, the will of the people can't be discerned from our recent presidential election. That it would be a dereliction of duty both to the people and to his oath to defend the constitution to hand over power to someone whose clear and declared intent is abuse the power of the office to fundamentally reshape or demolish our republic based on this highly suspect and incomplete result (remember, most people didn't even vote)

Here is my off the cuff proposal for what to do after that

A new election, everyone must vote. Trump and Harris on the ballot, but each major party must offer 2 candidates, and we're using Ranked Choice Voting. 1st place gets presidency, 2nd place gets VP.

Biden almost certainly won't do anything like this. He is clearly a coward with a stupid sense of optimism - a "things will be just fine, no need for any drastic measures" ever, mentality, and despite some rhetoric has shown no signs that he thinks there is anything to actually be concerned about from the party which has veered hard towards fascism. But, hey, a guy can dream.

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[–] [email protected] 64 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (3 children)

If you didn't vote you voted for this

[–] [email protected] 30 points 5 days ago (1 children)

We didn't vote, for this.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 5 days ago

maybe not voted but they definitely chose this. choosing to let whatever happens actually happen was a choice.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 days ago

"I say on my ass! You're welcome!"

[–] [email protected] 32 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Hate to break it to you but "didn't vote" isn't a candidate.

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[–] [email protected] 49 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (6 children)

Major political parties: Absolute shameless corruption and self-dealing while a thriving economy that could support families and rewarding living, sharing the unimaginable wealth of the modern world pretty equitably among any working person, collapses into an Uber-driving no health insurance hellscape. Give vote pls tho

Voters: Man fuck this

Major political parties: Shocked Pikachu face

Voters: Don’t really care about news or politics or really anything except video games and vape, I heard on social media that Biden is bad for the economy and Facebook has never lied to me in the past. I’m going to sit home and whack off instead of trying to effect some positive change in our politics

Trump: Hey just so you know, I’m going to have the military start shooting people I don’t like, pretty much the instant I’m back in power

Voters: Shocked Pikachu face

Edit: Typo

[–] [email protected] 13 points 5 days ago

Yep. I hate everything.

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 5 days ago (1 children)

The people who didn't vote may not have actively contributed to this, but they certainly did make a conscious choice to allow it to happen when they had the power to stop it.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 days ago (1 children)

It's a chicken and egg situation -- Bernie Sanders said “It should come as no great surprise that a Democratic Party which has abandoned working class people would find that the working class has abandoned them”

So do we blame people for being fed up or do we blame the ruling class for giving Americans so little to realistically hope for?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 days ago

Both. I hate when people present two separate issues as if it takes the ability for the other to be wrong. It's a false dichotomy.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 5 days ago (2 children)

A new election, everyone must vote.

This alone is a huge hurdle. There are people who have no form of ID and we have no free national form of ID, so that rules out any state that hard-requires voter ID. One also cannot assume that these people have the documents required (shitty parents, house fire, homelessness) nor the time and money required to get a state ID. Good luck trying to do a national ID as it brings out the crazies. So there would need to be programs on a per-state level to not only identify these people (as in knowing that there is a person like this in x location right now) but also identifying these people (as in their actual identity) and getting them an ID. This ignores that there are plenty of people who do not want to be identified.

identify all potential eligible voters and their current location for the required parts of the duration of the project
getting them proper ID as per state requirements
getting them to a place to vote
coming up with and enforcing some punishment for those that don't

Edit: Some of the timing hurdles I mention are also people who work two jobs (or more) with basically no time to themselves just to survive, let alone do all of the above (particularly when there is poor or no public transit and they don't drive). I lived out of a car for several months when I was 19 or so and a lot of people are a single paycheck away so don't think it's a non-issue.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 days ago (1 children)

money required to get a state ID

Why wouldn't this be considered a poll tax. There has to be a way for everyone that is legally allowed to vote to do so for free.

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[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Make getting an ID free then? Isn't that what both sides want? Fewer undocumented (by definition) for republicans, and more people voting for Democrats.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 days ago (1 children)

The ID being free helps (and maybe it is, based on what another poster mentioned; my knowledge is dated/local), but it still doesn't solve all the issues of getting the person to the place with the documents to get the ID.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 days ago

I know. I just struggle to see why it wouldn't be free already.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (2 children)

So, what if Biden used broad immunity SCOTUS granted to declare a crisis of democracy

You're proposing that Biden do the very thing you claim to loathe. You're proposing he engage in the behavior you suspect trump may engage in. Do you realize how unhinged your statements are? Invalidating an election would be the end of American democracy. Forcing people to vote who chose to abstain would be the end of American liberty. You want to do something because you're afraid it might be done. This was the election. These are the choices people made. Proposing radical responses because you didn't like the outcome puts you in the same category as the January 6th insurrectionists from 2020.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I agree with most of your points, but mandatory voting is not anti-freedom in my book. Plenty of places have it (Australia for example) and people can always choose to invalidate their ballot if they don't want to make a choice.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 days ago (1 children)

You need more then two parties for that to work. What happens if you get more spoiled ballots then anything else? Maybe no president for 4 years?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 days ago

The candidate with the most unspoiled ballots wins...

It's also literally never happened in the entire history of Australia. There's usually about 10% "informal" votes (spoiled ballots in your parlance).

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Except the difference is that the january 6th insurrectionists were too dumb to see what trump is. This time around, its the non-insurrectionsists who are too dumb.

On a more serious, but equally true, note: youre literally just rehashing the paradox of tolerism which has already been solved. If party A is going to do something, then party B should be able to do that too. Republicans are going to abuse power regaurdless of whether democrats do. At best, to argue that democrats should control themselves to not tempt republicans is victim blaming and makes you a republican apologist, at worst you are sealioning and are actually just a republican.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 days ago (7 children)

Second highest voter turn out in US history.

Please Please Please stop this.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

I'm not happy seeing my state in yellow up there. 😠

[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 days ago

Same

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (2 children)

The presumption here is that all the non voters would've voted against Trump - but even among motivated voters, that wasn't true. So who's to say more voters would've materially altered the outcome? What makes it likely there's a different outcome with more voices..? As I remember, it seemed like Kamala was behind all along

Also, the electoral outcomes don't change much if the yellow state was already aligned to your preference 🤷‍♂️ my vote wouldn't change the outcome of my state, years of voting on principle for independent and non incumbents have proven that to me, so why bother voting for the pres?

Especially when it is literally giant douche v turd sandwich - neither option represents a win.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 5 days ago (1 children)

that's not the point being made

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

What, and please tell us the point that is being made?

Is it that the election was not valid? Is it that the Democrats are somehow not the loser? Is it that the majority of Americans showed up to vote?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 days ago

it's about how many people didn't vote. that's literally it

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