this post was submitted on 14 Feb 2024
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e; I wrote a better headline than the ABC editors decided to and excerpted a bit more

According to the poll, conducted using Ipsos' Knowledge Panel, 86% of Americans think Biden, 81, is too old to serve another term as president. That figure includes 59% of Americans who think both he and former President Donald Trump, the Republican front-runner, are too old and 27% who think only Biden is too old.

Sixty-two percent of Americans think Trump, who is 77, is too old to serve as president. There is a large difference in how partisans view their respective nominees -- 73% of Democrats think Biden is too old to serve but only 35% of Republicans think Trump is too old to serve. Ninety-one percent of independents think Biden is too old to serve, and 71% say the same about Trump.

Concerns about both candidates' ages have increased since September when an ABC News/Washington Post poll found that 74% of Americans thought Biden -- the oldest commander in chief in U.S. history -- was too old to serve another term as president, and 49% said the same about Trump.

Archived at https://web.archive.org/web/20240214133801/https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/poll-americans-on-biden-age/story?id=107126589

Part that drew my eye,

The poll also comes days after the Senate failed to advance a bipartisan foreign aid bill with major new border provisions.

Americans find there is blame to go around on Congress' failure to pass legislation intended to decrease the number of illegal crossings at the U.S.-Mexico border -- with about the same number blaming the Republicans in Congress (53%), the Democrats (51%) and Biden (49%). Fewer, 39%, blame Trump.

More Americans trust that Trump would do a better job of handling immigration and the situation at the border than Biden -- 44%-26% -- according to the poll.

So that bipartisan border bill stunt was terrible policy, and it doesn't seem to have done anything for the Democratic party politically

Can we please stop trying to compromise with fascists now?

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[–] [email protected] 138 points 9 months ago (8 children)

We have a minimum age to become president, 35, so if that doesn't qualify as "age discrimination" then a maximum age limit shouldn't either.
65 should be the max, you get 30 years to try for the presidency then you're forced to retire.
And honestly that should be the maximum age for any elected official, not just the president.

[–] [email protected] 63 points 9 months ago

In America age discrimination is only illegal once you're 40 years old...

If you're 39 and 11 months, you can be denied a senior position for being too young, even if you have 20 years experience

Because old people write our laws, and they don't see a problem with telling a middle aged adult that they're too young.

If only one out of two groups have protection, it's not equaly opportunity, it's legislated discrimination.

It's insane because republicans constantly complain about valid equal opportunity, but never mention the one that's actually discriminatory.

It's especially insane when we have to pretend like an 81 year old magically is immune to scientifically proven medical facts

[–] [email protected] 12 points 9 months ago (5 children)

It is age discrimination but it's legal because it's built-in to the Constitution. Not joking, the "founders" decided that there was a such thing as too young but not too old.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 9 months ago

I think the founders made a lot of decisions based on the assumption that voters would vote in their own interests. This would preclude, for example, voting for insurrectionists, criminals, or corrupt power brokers.

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[–] [email protected] 46 points 9 months ago (4 children)

I literally don't care if they Weekend at Bernies Biden, I will vote for him happily if the alternative is Trump.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Biden could drop out and they could nominate a literal piece of driftwood covered in seagull shit, and I would vote for the driftwood if it were between that and Trump.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 9 months ago (12 children)

This might be the enlightened libertarian in me talking now, but I believe said driftwood would also be superior to Biden.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Driftwood probably wouldn't form the best cabinet though

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (5 children)

I feel like I should give you money for this comment

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[–] [email protected] 46 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (8 children)

Anything with eyes would say they are old. Yes, a 2-party system is broken in the modern world. Still Biden/ Harris as president is better then Putin's cuddle buddy.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Yes, a 2-party system is broken in the modern world.

I would love to have a 2-party system. But we have closer to a constellation of one party systems. Red States and Blue States, with a smattering of battlegrounds.

Between Winner-Take-All districts and the Electoral College, there's very little incentive to participate in an election in a municipality or state that's overwhelmingly one team or the other. And even when you do participate, you're limited to... what? People blowing up your phone and email with donation requests? A few months of block walking for a local candidate who you get to meet maybe twice and who barely knows your name? Running around bothering your friends a week before voting day not to sleep through this one? Getting drunk at a campaign event on election night, only to be dropped like a bad habit in the morning?

The parties themselves aren't really political entities. They're more like boosters for professional athletics teams or celebrity tours that you're expected to cheer for but never really interact with. They don't do anything outside of an election season. They don't provide any kind of constituent service or artery to the leadership themselves.

This consumerist politics is genuinely very different from the kind of organizing and activism that takes place throughout the rest of the democratic world. If it feels like Biden and Trump are just kinda being foisted on us by a cartel of party insiders, there's a good reason for it.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (1 children)

And a president isn't just the presidency, it also sets tons of agency heads and tons of judicial appointments including potential Supreme Court nominations. It's a major mistake to think of a presidential vote as a vote for one person, it's for tons of incredibly important positions that the president decides.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Even if that's true, wouldn't a younger person be better equipped to appoint and oversee those positions?

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[–] [email protected] 39 points 9 months ago (34 children)

Well, too bad. Those are the only two viable options, so most likely it's going to be one or the other. The time to do something about it has long passed. All we can do is hope Trump is jailed or either of them die.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago

Best government ever created by man, right there

[–] [email protected] 20 points 9 months ago (11 children)

There was NEVER anything any of us could do. The moment Biden announced he would run for reelection, everyone who mattered fell in line.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (2 children)

All we can do is hope Trump is jailed

Nothing in the Constitution bars Trump from holding the Office of the President while in a super max prison.

Absolutely nothing.

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 9 months ago (4 children)

73% of Democrats think Biden is too old to serve but only 35% of Republicans think Trump is too old to serve. Ninety-one percent of independents think Biden is too old to serve, and 71% say the same about Trump.

This is one of the really interesting takeaways. People are looking at Biden's gaffes--and he has always made verbals gaffes throughout his career as a politician--and saying that it's a sign that he's too old. Meanwhile, Trump, who trails Biden by a mere four years of age, is viewed as energetic and mentally sharp by Republicans. So essentially, Dems are pretty realistic in their assessment of both candidate's ages, while Republicans are only realistic about Biden.

Also - forcing the Senate to vote against their own compromise bill, a bill they'd worked on for months, was a fantastic bit of hilarity. They know that they're not going to be able to get a better bill under Trump--because the majority in the Senate would still shoot down their worst tendencies--but they couldn't risk bucking Trump. So they undid all their own work. ::chef kiss::

[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Meanwhile, Trump, who trails Biden by a mere four years of age, is viewed as energetic and mentally sharp by Republicans. So essentially, Dems are pretty realistic in their assessment of both candidate’s ages, while Republicans are only realistic about Biden.

I would bet my entire life savings that if you asked exactly the same Republicans exactly the same question about Trump in 4 years, their response would be exactly the same. Their assessment is not whether an 81 year old is too old to serve, it's that an 81 year old Democrat is too old to serve.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago

You can tell because they made the argument 4 years ago that Biden was too old to serve at 77.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago

You've basically just touched on how conservatives operate. It's never actually about any sort of philosophy, it has always been about control and projecting insecurities on the world.

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[–] [email protected] 28 points 9 months ago (10 children)

I'll vote for someone other than Biden when there's someone else to vote for.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago (2 children)

But he's too old!

But her emails!

COMEON!

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago

Anything goes just so they can win and sit back like Thanos after infinity war, smiling at the sun rise.

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Sadly in this cycle even the declared independent and third party candidates are beyond mediocre so far as well. Stupidest election of my lifetime (and I was born when LBJ was Pres).

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

You're not voting for only Trump or Biden. What you're also voting for is the people they bring in as admin.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (2 children)

Who cares? We shouldn't have the choices on the ballot being both choices that the majority of Americans don't want

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 9 months ago (4 children)

But it doesn't matter because those are the choices

[–] [email protected] 19 points 9 months ago

🦅 F R E E D O M 🇺🇸

[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago (8 children)

It really does matter. The implication is that the system is obviously broken because no one likes either choice.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (11 children)

Age is more than a number. Some people are very sharp at 80. Some are rapidly deteriorating at 60.

This is the point I wish everyone would remember when they're discussing this issue. It's not the age, but the 'wear and tear' that matters.

Some people age more gracefully than others, and we truly do want to have our elders wisdom, especially during trying times.

Having said all that, my personal opinion on all of this is that Biden seems to have cognitively/physically worn down past the level required for the decision-making/stresses of the office of the Presidency.

If he wants to have a third party doctor give him a cognizant test, and he passes it, and he publicly notifies all of us voters of that, then I would be up for voting for him again.

But judging based on the very little I'm allowed to see, as a voter, based on how few public news conferences that he does, and having seen him faltering in some of those, it truly does seem like it's time for him to move on.

Also IMO, Trump is a semen stain on the soul of America, and he quite literally is a test to see if America is America, or not. If we reaffirm our leader as someone who, as a 'wolf in sheeps clothing', is a very immoral and unethical grifter, then we are lost. All of us.

Not that it's going to happen, but both parties should be putting someone else up as their candidates for the presidency of the United States of America in 2024.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

Well, who do y'all think can beat trump, because that's who's running in 4 years regardless of this election's outcome.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 months ago (10 children)

Any Democratic candidate with a pulse, and tbh we could probably get voters to moderate their expectations on both of those points if we had to

60% of the country has grown to hate and fear Trump just as much as 40% of it adores him

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

I meant my question literally. If Biden wins 2024, Kamala 2028 feels like a bad decision. If it goes the other way, there's a non-zero chance the Dems are running against trump3, or a trump-like that beats him in the gop primaries, or both.

Whoever the Dems field in 2028 has to start making a name for themselves sooner rather than later, and I'm mostly disappointed the Dems aren't using the primaries as a way to show off that candidate.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago (2 children)

The bothsiderist media is happy to let a fascist slide into office all while acting like they just have to harp on Biden's age.

Suppose Biden becomes unable to do the job. So what? There are plenty of capable people are him, and Harris will just assume the office. Big deal; not much changes.

But if tiny d gets into office...he's been promising to be the con movement's "vengeance" and promising to be a dictator (but only for a day, yeah right).

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago (2 children)

What is the population percentage of boomers, around 40%, per chance?

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (1 children)

59% of Americans should have been paying attention a year ago when something could have been done about it. The choice is made now, so accept the reality and choose one (preferably the one who is not a convicted sex offender with 93 felony indictments).

[–] [email protected] 12 points 9 months ago (4 children)

59% of Americans should have been paying attention a year ago when something could have been done about it.

What thing? The Democrats basically didn't have a primary. All the potential internal rivals to Biden bowed out.

The Republicans had a conga-line of sacrificial lambs. I even saw a few spicy Op-Eds suggesting that a true anti-Trump Democrat should be actively campaigning for Ron DeSantis or Nikki Haley. But... Trump's a fucking hog. He's got every AM radio and Evangelical Church repping him. What were "59% of Americans" who'd been otherwise alienated from the political process supposed to do? Build an entirely new party from first principles and put... idfk... Mark Zuckerberg or Elon Musk on the top?

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

I would vote for VP Kamala Harris to be POTUS before any of them others.

So Biden it is. The "Eisenhower Box" bends to No Hitler.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (5 children)

Isn't this why you have the VP running mates? You vote for them just as much.

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