“Today a Republican admitted she plans to help orchestrate another insurrection if Trump loses again in 2024... Now here’s Tom with the weather.” - NBC News, basically
this post was submitted on 07 Jan 2024
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The rolling insurrection continues. Rep. Stefanik needs to see some charges, be removed from office, and 14th amendment prevent her from hold any office ever again. Take the gloves off Joe. No negotiation with terrorists, no kit gloves for insurrectionists.
A smart liar (e.g. the ones who didn't end up in stories like this) would've just said yes and planned to do what they were going to do anyway. This is the low-hanging fruit.
We're to the point where fascists are comfortable saying shit like this.
Only the best anti-American racist idiots.
Right, but the point of her response was to tell Trump she is loyal and would make a good VP.
At this point nobody in the GOP cares what the public thinks. They know GOP voters will vote for the Trump ticket no matter what. And Democrats will be the first against the wall after the election.
So that leaves just one audience member.
On one hand, definitely. But you and I aren't her target audience.
I press in the sharpie very hard when I vote against her.
On the face of it, it is manifestly reasonable to say that you'll certify on the condition that the election is free and fair- that is, after all, always the condition of doing so. But that's not what she's saying here- she's repeating claims that 2020 was invalid
In reality it's extremely unlikely that the election in 2024 will be unfair or rigged against the GOP, and she deserves all the opprobrium she has coming her way for creating the impression (for her audience) that an unfair election is likely to occur or that 2020 was rigged or illegal. After all, that's the rhetorical setup MAGA created in the run-up to 2020: if they lost, it was unfair (and therefore, time to do a treason/coup).
Her rhetoric here could simply be a prediction that 2024 will be an illegitimate election, or it could be a cue for her audience to prepare to accept or commit political violence in 2024- and as such, it is a textbook example of stochastic terrorism and should be understood as such. Also the media that declines to note this should be evaluated as enabling, vs. holding to account
ship of theseus arguments are their stock in trade. You start with a statement no one could disagree with, like "I will vote to certify the election if it seems like a free and fair election. If it seems otherwise, I will lead an investigation that will root out fraud and ensure the people's voices are heard." Then you start doing string substitutions:
"it seems like a free and fair election" gets subbed for "Trump wins"
"it seems otherwise" == "Trump loses"
"lead an investigation that will root out fraud" == "obstruct the proceedings"
"the people's voices are heard" == "Trump is installed as dictator for life"
Then you pretend you never made those substitutions, and you get to rhetorically hammer your opponents for being against free and fair elections and in favor of fraud. After all, everyone else heard the very reasonable "I will vote to certify the election if it seems like a free and fair election. If it seems otherwise, I will lead an investigation that will root out fraud and ensure the people's voices are heard." But the party faithful clearly heard: "I will vote to certify the election if Trump wins. If Trump loses, I will obstruct the proceedings and ensure Trump is installed as dictator for life."
Innuendo Studios has a great video about how the Christian Nationalist terrorists use their media pipelines to establish public vs private definitions of phrases, and then use those equivocated phrases to say one thing to the general public and another thing to their base.
ship of theseus arguments are their stock in trade.
Yes, if they couldn't ship unpopular politics misleadingly as uncontroversial feel-good slam-dunks, they'd never get any support in politics. It's a pity that sort of rhetoric works as well as it does
Also Innuendo's work is fantastic
Sure glad the centrist establishment media just gave her a multiweek bonanza on a non-issue. Good job guys! At least they performed the critical role of nationalizing an, at most, university-wide story at the behest of conservatives bent on destroying the country.
She's obviously setting up for another attempt to overthrow the government.
The first attempt has never ended
It's really weird, disconcerting and discouraging that both sides accuse each other of stealing, both sides have rather ardent and vocal bases, both bases want to jail the politicians involved but only one side actually time and again gets caught cheating, lying and stealing, yet has the most loyal and fanatic base that actually want to murder those thst don't agree.
I get the average trump voter as they actually believe the nonsense they believe in, a lot can be said about gullibility, racism, etc, but as they are fed a steady diet of lies that include "the brown ones are coming to kill you" I get where they're coming from. They're mostly terrified because they're fed terror every goddamn day even though mostly nothing happens.
If the world survives this election (big if right there) can we please PLEASE do something about news providers in the US? Shut down oan, Fox News, etc. put laws in place requiring news organisations to be truthful. Yes, mistakes can be made but if a news organization sees that they publish untrue information, they must retract it and publish and equally big retraction. If they push too much to ignoring certain facts from whichever political isle, they must be punished, HARD. I don't care if it's left or right extremism, all need to be curved, news needs to be neutral facts to inform the general public.
With news changing to influencers, apply those rules to influencers as well. Yes, free speech must be a thing, but once you have an audience, you're not allowed to feed them bullshit that goes against the greater good. It's the same as yelling "fire!" in a theater. There are logical limits to free speech, this should be one of them.
This limitless lying that organisations like Fox News are allowed to do right now has caused possibly irreparable damage to so many things, it has destroyed lives and may end humanity altogether (hello, global warming "myth"!)
Cut the shit, stop the lying. We need to change how news and baseline truth and facts are given to the general population. If you lie, be it that you're a news organization, a company selling snake oil medications, a politician, an influencer, whatever it is, once you reach a group, you either are truthful or you get punished.
If you allow us to cheat and just steal the presidency, I'll see it as legal and valid
I don't know exactly when we stopped hanging traitors, but I'd like to return to that policy.
Nah, too gruesome and we're better than that.
Publicly exposing them for the liars they are, ejecting them from public offices for life, putting them on registries, etc. is better.
It requires though that we start defining a baseline truth in news and facts. I know that there are risks of fascism taking over through that through propaganda, but if we can ensure that news and facts are based on reality, science, etc, then we have a chance of getting it done right
How? There are flat earthers... Fact has nothing to do with it.
The republican traitor swine must be crushed under the heel of justice.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
After Welker pressed her again on the matter, Stefanik wouldn’t commit to certifying the election results and criticized efforts to remove Trump from the ballot in Colorado, Maine and other states.
And the Supreme Court is taking that case up in February — that should be a nine to zero to allow President Trump to appear on the ballot because that’s the American people’s decision to make this November.”
Stefanik also defended Trump’s recent remarks calling rioters who stormed the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021, and remain in prison “hostages,” echoing that language herself.
During a rally in Iowa on Saturday, Trump urged President Joe Biden to release the rioters from federal prison: “I call them hostages.
When asked if she stood by the comments that she made on the House floor calling Jan. 6 a “truly tragic day for America,” Stefanik said, "I have concerns about the treatment of January 6 hostages."
Biden deputy campaign manager Quentin Fulks responded to Stefanik in his own appearance on "Meet the Press," saying: “I’m not sure that this 'I know you are, but what am I' situation is going to work when it comes to democracy."
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