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this post was submitted on 17 Jan 2024
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the_dunk_tank
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It's the dunk tank.
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It has just struck me that this is the same tactic Israel uses with antisemitism. It's self-reinforcing because it causes antisemitism in foreign countries, which causes jews to support Israel because of the antisemitism.
The LGBT and women's rights cudgel the west uses to advance economic domination and power causes reactionary anti-lgbt behaviour in foreign countries, and in turn that homophobia and misogyny causes LGBT and women's rights people to even more strongly support the west.
We call it "Homonationalism" and it is the absolute slimiest tactic
The difficulty here is discussing it without also looking like you're anti-lgbt. Which is similar to the difficulty that previously existed with discussing zionism without also looking like you're antisemitic. The immediate assumption most people go to is that you're a raging homophobe.
Can I get a "hell yeah" for nato bootlickers calling the ace trans lesbian a homophobe??? Real shit!
I always open with "I do not want imperialists using the rights they won't even give me as a cudgel against the global south"
We have the same shit going on as the jewish anti-zionists. This is actually pretty revelatory for me, I had not connected these things before but it's so similar.
EDIT: Like holy fuck there's a reason we see "but they throw gays off rooftops" come up so often when it comes to palestine too. Same fucking thing. It even gets used FOR zionism itself.
Yup! Zionists fuckin LOVE their homonationalism, look up Brand Israel and bring a puke bucket. Also watch Pride Denied: Homonationalism & The Future of Queer Politics!
I look forward to your future posting about this, it's a very interesting connection! False consciousness bears some commonality across seemingly-disparate cases, turns out.
Man I don't know what future posting that might be I'm just winging it but this is a really weird connection I'm surprised hasn't been frequently made. More importantly it's a connection that I think will hold some strength in convincing lgbt people, particularly because support for palestine is so strongly formed now and distaste for israel absolutely cemented.
Weird day for me. Had all kinds of weird thoughts suddenly pop out like this. Like brain cylinders all just decided to fire at once.
I'm half wondering if these commonalities are actually there across all the other bullshit. Might be a whole bunch of other connections in other identity issues that use exactly the same bullshit self reinforcing feedback loops.
I mentioned in a different reply that this isn't a new thing and you can probably find ancient authors discussing it. Just for fun, I checked a list Schopenhauer published circa 1851 that was basically just "38 things I've frequently seen assholes do to win debates" and lo and behold:
"Re-education program? Sounds pretty authoritarian to me. Quit spouting tankie shit." etc.
Obviously Schopenhauer is highly fallible and this is a discarded listicle that even he himself didn't like that much, but my point is that this is a common thought that may not be as present in the public consciousness now, but has been at various points in history among various groups.
Using examples of prior writers remarking on it (but without formally naming it) adds weight to its existence in my opinion. This kind of thing would strengthen it in anything written about it.
i'm a removed, it's easy for me. the correct response to "hm so you hate the LGBT Community??" is "shut the fuck up imperialist, if a queer joins the US army they should be hanged for treason."
Holy shit we need a "not in our name" movement for lgbt people.