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this post was submitted on 07 Jul 2023
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And only the poor and/or uneducated will stay behind. The USA is going down fast.
Bad take. There aren't droves of people leaving the U.S.
High skilled immigration to the U.S is still big. Hell, its a problem for European tech companies, as their best engineers get poached by the U.S.
Might be a surprising take for some, but Europeans still move to the U.S today. Not in the droves of the 20th century, but still an amount. 12% of all immigrants to the U.S are from Europe in 2021.
That's not immigration, those Europeans generally don't move to the US to stay. The US are a place to make lots of money while your're young, who the hell would want to fund a family or grow old there: The wages might be high, but to get an equivalent level of social security and general quality of life none of it would be left.
Can confirm. Made the painful decision to move back to Europe because we wouldn't have been able to afford the kid's studies, growing old and sick with no retirement and so on
I think it depends. I’m a software dev in the U.S. I have talked to many developers in Europe who feel like they are stuck, and are making a pittance compared to what they make in the U.S. If you were to talk to one of these people, they would be providing a different perspective than what you are telling me right now. And it turns out, moving is hard no matter where you are from.
Personally, I’ve crunched the numbers. Even with social benefits, moving to Europe for me would be a mistake.
Btw, I know multiple European families in the U.S. They aren’t all just here temporarily. Not everyone just keeps moving on a whim.
I’m one of the immigrant families lol.
I think it depends. I'm a software dev in the U.S. I have talked to many developers in Europe who feel like they are stuck, and are making a pittance compared to what they make in the U.S. If you were to talk to one of these people, they would be providing a different perspective than what you are telling me right now. And it turns out, moving is hard no matter where you are from.
Personally, I've crunched the numbers. Even with social benefits, moving to Europe for me would be a mistake.
Btw, I know multiple European families in the U.S. They aren't all just here temporarily. Not everyone just keeps moving on a whim.
I'm one of the immigrant families lol.
I don't think that's really true. The US is still the largest economy and attracts many educated and highly skilled people in the tech sector.
Certain parts are declining for sure, but I don't think that applies to the whole country.
That's what I mean. The middle class is shrinking to non-existent. The few that can afford to jump out of it do it and only someone who can live really well in the USA would consider going there.
The USA will become a land of the rich and poor. No more middle-class.
The educated are paid way more in the US. Americans buy houses and stuff. Unimaginable for most Europeans who don't get to inherit one. Also Europe is on the decline. Due to terrible demographics mostly.
Buying a house in a soulless suburb and living on the driver's seat of a car staring at nothing but other cars and concrete? No, thanks. I believe in the inherent superiority of urbanity.
Also a house that is made of paper
Not everyone wants to live in a dystopian country. Yes you earn more but everything is also more expensive and things like decent public transport and not to see misery everyday are also nice
Please don't forget healthcare, where you might need that plus money instantly.
You're being downvoted, but the salary argument is completely true.
I did some calculations before when I was talking to my friend. I live in the U.S now. I'm Romanian. If I were to move back to Romania I'd be taking something like a 70% salary cut. If I were to move somewhere Americans are more familiar with like the Netherlands, I would be taking something like a 40% salary cut.
You guys in here are patting each other on the back, but I've talked to some miserable engineers from Europe who feel like they have no way out. They are making a pittance what their peers are making elsewhere.
I've got bad news for you. The median income-housing ratio is going down on both sides of the pond.
Agree with the rest though.
Honey what, you seen the housing market recently?? Fuck I'd trip and break my arm and get the Honor of being a slave to the system for the rest of my life
"Terrible demographics" will ensure bigger inheritances to Europeans..