i can't even guess as to why they went quiet. not one guess at all. we will never know.
edit: well they're not quiet now once they get called out
this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2024
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Focusing on these people was an unhealthy obsession, and most of the attempts to reach them were needlessly adversarial to the point of being toxic and hardening their resolve to not vote for Harris. Gaza was a losing issue for Harris and this attention just kept it front and center. Sad to see the obsession continue.
Anyways, this is not why Harris lost. It was a landslide and Trump won the popular vote by a huge margin. Americans don't vote in large numbers on foreign policy - not unless Americans are getting killed. Kamala lost because she kept telling struggling families that the economy is great.
The funniest thing about is like, I live in fucking Illinois. And I voted for the Dems downballot where it actually matters. All the words spilled, all the hate and anger that's been directed at me, has been over a single third party vote in one of the safest states in the country. The vast majority of Americans live in safe states too.
In reality it's just about enforcing the social norms of the tribe.
I'm in Illinois as well. I've personally come to the conclusion that voting third party isn't a great option. The only third party that ostensibly aligns with me is the Green party, but their strategies make it clear to me that they actually exist to spoil elections, not advance issues. Our votes are technically irrelevant, but I'd rather not help legitimize the Green party.
I voted for PSL, personally.
I can respect that. It definitely sends the right message.
I disagree with your assessment but appreciate your civility, as well as the fact that you acknowledge how obsessed people are with blaming undecided voters.
The stats I've seen show that Gaza was actually a significant issue in some swing states and absolutely could have improved Harris' chance at victory.
Many Americans have family members who are being killed in Gaza. Not to mention the risk of American troops being deployed increases as Israel becomes more and more belligerent.
Many Americans are also horrified at the fact that their tax dollars are being used to commit a genocide.
I try to follow a "generous tit for tat" strategy on tone, unless I'm arguing with the libertarian-right in which case going full asshole from the start just saves time.
I know that American opinions on Palestine are deeply against the genocide, but that's a different conversation than what drives actual votes.
It still is. What's done is absolutely done and every time I look at stuff like this on this platform it makes me feel like people are witch hunting. Right now progressives and the general left need solidarity more than ever now.
The people who withed their vote hurt us all but we can't exactly afford to alienate them.
I know the post election wounds are still fresh but hopefully the finger pointing stops soon. Besides non-voters I've seen people blaming minorities, I've seen people blaming women and I'm sure there's many other demographics people have blamed.
Lovely inversion of responsibility there...
So what do you do when people keep screaming about Genocide Joe? Ignore them and hope they go away?
At this point, why should I care? It's not like it's entirely inaccurate, and I have no particular affection for racist Joe.
Well, enjoy your new president then
The election is over. Our new President is the Fault of Biden, Harris, and worthless Democratic consultants. Pretending otherwise isn't going to give us a second shot.
We can't nominate better voters in 4 years, so we better start thinking of nominating better candidates.
join them, duh
This is exactly why so many dug their heels in. The idea of leftists making a weird or nonsensical decision baffled and enraged many other leftists and liberals, the unhealthy obsession metastasized to full-blown cancer towards the election, I swear the left was arguing more with itself than the MAGA's, and that's also by design, nobody wants to debate the right because they're insane, so better focus efforts on those who supposedly want the same thing, right?
The funny thing about the human mind that nobody gets yet is that attention is more important than what kind of attention, the fact that their obstinance about not voting democrat was getting them so much attention, making them feel like the persecuted minority, getting support from like-minds, it just created a mini-MAGA front. And sure, it probably wouldn't have changed the election but it shows clearly how the only thing standing between us and a better future is our own idiocy as a species. Every damn time, we're going to sabotage our collective future because of our personal feelings. MAGA are just people less aware of the world and more happy to be who they are. That's the only difference between us.
Adding in an edit: downvote it all you want, you know it's true. Hell, in his last election he DID lose the popular vote. Some democracy. More voters, actual people who took the time and effort to go and actually vote, wanted a different president, and got shown their votes don't matter unless they live in a swing state.
------------original comment-----------------------
Anyways, this is not why Harris lost. It was a landslide and Trump won the popular vote by a huge margin. Americans don't vote in large numbers on foreign policy - not unless Americans are getting killed. Kamala lost because she ~~kept telling struggling families that the economy is great~~ has a vagina.
Fixed that for you.
Also she didn't lose the pop vote by a huge margin. 3 million people is literally 1 percent of the population.
If this were a democracy and pop vote mattered, there are probably 10x that number of people who would have actually voted. Then I'd guess she would have won. Look at (greater area) Chicago. 9.5m people. 12 million people total in IL. how many Illinoisans didn't vote because why does it matter? About 2 million probably.
Disclaimer: That last paragraph was obviously arbitrary.
Stop blaming vaginas for not getting votes
Our household didnt like Harris explicitly because of Gaza so... No. We're also in a safe state to vote 3rd party so it didn't matter anyway. Down ballot blue passed for us at least.
Interesting that you seem to assume that Harris would have done better with the people who didn't vote than with the people who did.
A Democrats losing the popular vote to a Republican by 1% is a huge margin. What matters isn't the entire population, it's the swing voters.
Democrats straddle the desires of their wealthy patrons and the desires of voters. They always try to give the people just enough to scrape by. The result is that we consistently have elections with tight margins. Democrats are playing a game of high stakes chicken every election.
You're assuming that the entire 1% were swing voters. So no. It's not a huge margin.
Ok average nearly half the country votes, every year. Yeah - that number should be way up - but 75% of those votes wouldn't matter. That's the point/problem.
If at least 1% over the electorate is swing voters, then that definitionally makes up the critical 1% Trump margin. That's just what swing voters are.
The actual margin is more like 4-5% when you consider the extra votes Democrats need to win the electoral college.
While establishing actual democracy is absolutely a priority, it's not a guarantee that we would have had a better outcome. Australia has RCV and compulsory voting already, and are trending right anyways.
No it won't magically fix everything but at least the voters would have no one to blame but themselves for who they elect to office.