this post was submitted on 27 Dec 2024
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Blåhaj Lemmy is a Lemmy instance attached to blahaj.zone. This is a group for questions or discussions relevant to either instance.

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Neopronouns are not trolling (lemmy.blahaj.zone)
submitted 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
 

I've been waiting until after Christmas day to make this post, but some of our communities recently have had a lot of noise and upset over someone that uses neopronouns that most people are unfamiliar with.

So I want to make this clear. A persons pronouns are to be respected. This is true when the user is using neopronouns that you're unfamiliar with. It's true even if you think someone is trolling. Pronouns are not rewards for good behaviour. They aren't only to be respected when you like the person you're interacting with, or if their pronouns "make sense" to you. Trolls, spammers, twitter users, it doesn't matter who they are, your options are to respect their pronouns, or to not engage with them.

I really want to re-iterate the importance of this. Gender diverse folk are undermined, invalidated and questioned at every step of our lives. As a community, we need to be working to undo that, not creating more of it, and that means there is no space for treating pronouns (including neopronouns) as a reward for good behaviour.

This isn't a free reign for trolls and spammers. The rules still apply. Trolling, spamming, etc will continue to be dealt with, but it's not an excuse to act as if respecting someones pronouns is optional.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 week ago

Holy shit this thread has become a prime example of why we love you so much Ada, I've literally never seen a safer place on the internet before and I'm including my own community I run outside of lemmy.

Endlessly defending trans people and banning all those who refuse to accept basic rules, it's incredible although disturbing seeing how many transphobes have come out of the woodwork.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (8 children)

i bite my thumb at anyone who complains about drag. the most drag has ever done is correct people and VERY OCCASIONALLY call out when someone is actively belligerent about it.

reckon how folks treat our dearest dragonfucker is pretty good insight into how they’d react to myriad other similar social situations. this heavily contributes to why i have very little patience for folks “just asking (bad faith) questions” about it.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 week ago

Thank you. it is mindboggling that supposed trans allies can tell people they aren't valid without seeing their hypocrisy.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 week ago

Without ever making a post on the Lemmy, I have donated to this instance every month for well over a year, amounting to hundreds. Your principled moderation is why I am here. I will forever be grateful for the space you've given us

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 week ago (2 children)

yo only vaguely related, but pugjesus is REALLY being an asshole about drag. i figured this is a safe place to vent lmao

that powertrippinbastards community gets worse every time i dip my head in, i swear

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 week ago (17 children)

Lemmy seems to be getting worse unfortunately :\

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 week ago (3 children)

thanks for being around, ada. the work you do is greatly appreciated, even if it’s not readily apparent all the time.

imo @MossyFeathers said it best in an edit they made to this comment, quoted for visibility:

the fucking entitlement of cis people telling trans people how to run their spaces is sickening. I thought Lemmy was supposed to be fairly progressive, yet once again I’m being shown that cis people believe they deserve a voice in something that has nothing to do with them. You don’t get to call yourself an ally when you question someone’s validity.

You disgust me.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 week ago (1 children)

To be fair, pugjesus is an asshole about a lot of things, not just drag.

/s

I took a look and this is their normal behavior: just the topic du jour that they can use to whip up drama.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Very true. I do hope that the one or two trolls who instigated this post stop getting free rein to start drama. Pronouns should be respected, narcissism should not.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

How Can Pronous Be Real If Our Eyes Aren't Real? /s

But actually, s/he & they are pronouns I'll use in everyday speech. Anything else and I tend to favor a person's name; it's just... You know, easier to facilitate a conversation that way.

Edit: oh I see this is from blåhaj. Nvm. I stand by my comment but I see I'm not the target audience.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Neopronouns are valid as hell and all these people who refuse to acknowledge that fact are by definition transphobic.

You cannot claim to support trans people while declaring a subgroup to be invalid because you think they're not doing it the right way. You are not an ally unless you support all trans people, people who use neopronouns are not the problem, you are.

Policing trans people makes you a transphobe.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago (5 children)

My problem is the intense amount of trolls and the harm that they've caused. Ive seen this instance devolve into trolls, counter trolls (trolls), alt accounts (trolls), mods (myself included) not being able to keep up, and admins not doing enough (imo).

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

The alternative, is a queer instance that is built from the ground up with gatekeeping baked in to its core. You may be ok with that. I am not. This instance will never be that.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago

Thank you, Ada. I truly wish it had not come to this, but making this post is one of a very few good choices you could make in such an awfully difficult situation. I respect your vision and commitment for the space you want to create here and I hope it works out for the best.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

My only problem is when i use singular they them for someone and they have a problem with it. I speak hungarian natively which has no grammatical gender nor gendered pronouns and it makes so much more sense. The whole thing about gender neutral language doesnt exist. But what makes me mad is that other languages that have genders solved it while english is still messing around and every time i use singular they or dude/guy as gender neutral, someone with neopronouns or a right winger has to point out how im incorrect. This is of course not pointed at those who use neopronouns, just as someone who speaks a language where pronouns dont matter it feels kinda useless.

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[–] aredditimmigrant 11 points 1 week ago (3 children)

As Cishet white-ish person, who is only tangentially connected to this community IRL, but wants to be supportive, is there a definitive list of pronouns? It seems to me and many other people that if you just keep adding more and more, people get confused and or feel alienated and then some people get angry when confused, because they get frustrated and don't want to do the wrong thing.

I usually default to "they" unless absolutely told, because It seems that once it gets so individualized, things go a bit nuts. We may as well just abolish all pronouns and only use proper nouns.

Side question, I'm neurodiverse (diagnosed ADHD, probably a bit on the spectrum), I feel very very weird before coming out to people, especially at work, as I think it will be used against me. There are still places in this world that would hurt/imprison/kill non-cis, non-hetero people. With such an interconnected world, especially with those places, how does one handle it while also trying to keep being proud of your identity? Wouldn't putting neo pronouns in a profile open you up for targeting?

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 week ago

take note bluesky this is how to build trust and safety 💙

and it's another reason why i love it here 💞

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