this post was submitted on 21 Nov 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago) (2 children)

Materialist answer (inspired by a video called Why The Political Compass is Wrong: Establishing An Accurate Model of Political Ideology, by breadtuber Halim Alrah.)

Business owner makes money by paying workers to produce widgets at $6 / unit. Owner sells these widgets at $10 / unit, making a $4 profit each sale.

Before long, the workers catch on to the reality of the situation: the owner could be making a lot less and still be able to provide "leadership" (or whatever it is he provides). They decide not to work for less than... $8 per unit. With this price, the owner will still be wealthy. But now, so will the workers.

Workers save up money and use it to go on strike.

However: business owner comes up with a better solution to the problem: he divides the workers into brown-eyed workers and blue-eyed workers. He then gets the government to discriminate heavily against the brown-eyed workers. His cronies in government make it legal to deny brown-eyed workers jobs and housing. His cronies in the media write hysterical anecdotal stories about various brown-eyed rapists, thieves, and murderers.

Terrified mobs -- stoked into a frenzy by the business owner's well-funded propaganda -- tear down brown-eyed people's homes and food supplies, forcing them destitute before the strike is done.

The brown-eyed workers now must choose between returning to work for the business owner at $5 / unit... or starving to death.

The blue-eyed workers, meanwhile, have just been tricked into betraying their own team. Some were not tricked, but simply unprepared. These blue-eyed workers stood by in either shock, uncertainty, or laziness. Unable to comprehend how their fellow blue-eyed workers could have become so foolish and so cruel.

But now the business owner can put up the illusion of no longer needing the blue-eyed workers. He can run his factory on a skeleton crew of desperate, brown-eyed workers, and say to the blue, "uh oh! Looks like the brown-eyed workers just stole your jobs!"

Much like the brown-eyed workers, the blue-eyed workers have a restricted set of choices: A) admit they were suckers, fooled into attacking their own team, and try to rebuild their union, or B) double down and blame brown-eyed people for undercutting them... but reluctantly return to work, because the strike has been broken. Or, C) just like the brown-eyed workers, they can choose to starve to death.

The business owner wins, and now society has an eye-color-discrimination problem. Eye color was an arbitrary characteristic. Now it decides where someone lives, who they spend time with, and what kind of opportunities they have access to.

The business owner can rinse and repeat for: skin tone, religion, country of origin, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc. As the saying goes,

"Divide and conquer."

[–] [email protected] 1 points 51 minutes ago

Incredible answer! I saved this with my running list of great quotes and passages.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 hour ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 hour ago
[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 hours ago

Their systems of power rely on having an "in" group and an "out" group. Overt racism is less acceptable these days because now there are brown Republicans, but transphobia? Very in.

They're just choosing a new group to "other" so that we don't realize they're coming for everyone who doesn't fit into their narrow worldview.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 hour ago

There are a lot of factors at play that make transness an easy target to be the scary other bigots rally around.

The simple truth is that unless you yourself are trans you cannot understand the trans experience. There is no way to explain the scope or impact it has on someone's life. It's automatically alien and provides essentially a permanent out group. Anyone who is uncomfortable with people who are different or that have different experiences than themselves are almost certainly transphobic to some degree. Right now to the best of my knowledge transphobia is the only thing all hate groups share.

Trans people are the current scapegoats because prior to the pandemic we had an explosion of trans people feeling safe enough to come out online (I blame Obama making us all feel safe). They are particularly effective because both white nationalists and evangelicals use queerness as a scapegoat all the time anyway so it was easy for them to rally around. Which is why conservative politicians fearmonger around trans people.

It's not that simple, but it's close enough for a lemmy comment.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

I never heard of one shooting up a school church or whatever.

First off, one must be very careful of generalizing to an entire group from the actions of a small sample [1]. Using the metric of whether there have been trans people who have engaged in mass shootings is quite reductionist, and is a faulty generalization — if I am to interpret what you said to mean that "conservatives" are "against" all trans people because they think that they are all responsible for "shooting up" schools and churches. Second, to address your belief, to my knowledge, there has been at least one instance of a school shooter being trans [2].

References

  1. "Faulty Generalization". Wikipedia. Published: 2024-03-25T17:50Z. Accessed: 2024-11-23T02:49Z. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faulty_generalization
  2. "2023 Nashville school shooting". Wikipedia. Published: 2024-10-28T23:08Z. Accessed: 2024-11-23T02:51Z. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Nashville_school_shooting.
[–] [email protected] 17 points 5 hours ago (1 children)
  1. People fear new unknown things (as perceived by the individual), especially when it comes to bodies and human form, instinctively.

  2. It doesn't conform to their strict societal standards as crafted by thousands of years of culture and history. The authorities have always persecuted and cracked down on anything that threatens the patriarchal standard.

  3. Minorities make the easiest targets. Trans people are an extreme minority.

  4. Some people think it has more to do with sexuality and sexual urges, so their perception is that it is perversion.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 hours ago

Projection is also a common way for people to deflect blame for societal ills. Religious zealots will ignore and even shield sexual abusers present in their own institutions and divert that animosity to outside groups that make convenient targets. They are ok with the abusers within their walls because they are seeking absolution through religious systems. They are not ok with queer people because they need to scapegoat a group to explain why things don't seem to be getting better.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

From what I have seen, it seems trans and gay people are used as a "bar." Since these people aren't inclined to be gay or trans they believe themselves to be above the bar they have set. Racism works the same way.

They tried to put their religion into politics and it backfired; now their religion is just random politics with a few supernatural beliefs that do not effect their day to day actions.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 18 minutes ago)

Why does it seem most people, mainly conservatives, against Trans people?

I think it's important to establish the validity of the claim, and the assumptions being made, since you cited no sources, nor did you provide any definitions, nor did you specify any assumptions; I will presume that by "conservative", you are referring to American Republicans.

Why does it seem most people [...][are] against Trans people?

It does not appear that "most people" (I assume you mean "the majority of people") are "against trans people" (I'm not entirely sure exactly what you mean by this, so I will assume it means not being in favor of protecting trans people from discrimination) [1.2][1.1].

Why does it seem [...] conservatives [...][are] against Trans people?

It does seem that the majority of Republicans are against trans protections [1.1].

References

  1. "Americans’ Complex Views on Gender Identity and Transgender Issues". Author: Kim Parker, Juliana Menasce Horowitz, Anna Brown. Publisher: Pew Research Center. Published: 2022-06-28. Accessed: 2024-11-23T02:35Z. https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2022/06/28/americans-complex-views-on-gender-identity-and-transgender-issues/.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 hours ago

In a less direct way one standing theory is that it’s tied to cultural issues with gender relations and due to the lack of a cultural role for us (at least in cultures where that applies or where those roles were damaged during colonialism, which was very common). Then there’s also the oversexualization of trans people.

For the first one Julia Serrano does a good job going into a lot of detail for a big chunk of it, but the quick summary is that there’s two axes of sexism: traditional (one sex and that which is associated is better than the other, traditionally prioritizing the masculine over the feminine) and oppositional (that that which is associated is deeply connected and immutable). All sorts of people run up against oppositional sexism, from cis gay people to dudes who like to sew. But it’s likely necessary to reinforce traditional sexism.

Then there’s the lack of cultural space. It’s being built, but it isn’t done yet and until it’s been uncontroversial for some time it’ll be at risk. It’s the issues of “I don’t know how to treat them” and “it’s against god”. It’s people angry that their understanding of one of the most vital parts of their culture is being called to make space for something that’s new to them

Then there’s the oversexualization. Trans people all throughout the world have a long history of resorting to sex work to survive. That means that to many people our existence is seen as inherently sexual. I grew up where trans people only appeared on tv as tragic sex workers, jokes of erotic disgust, or Springer style freak shows, and the next closest depictions were as murderous erotic crossdressers (which many saw as the same thing). And so now here I am, one of them, demanding you treat me as an educated professional and a peer and a decent chunk of bigots will see my face as inherently pornographic and therefore unfit to display around children. They hear about teenagers wanting to transition and think of it as sexualizing them. And for a certain portion of people they’re mad that a porn category and type of exotic hooker is demanding rights

There’s more, and I didn’t say it all the best I could (typed it out off and on over a while between doing things as well as it being something I mostly break down in discussions with other trans people). But yeah, we’re different and we challenge basic understandings of some of the foundations of society and culture, but our liberation helps break down the issues you’re already facing and a lot of the time the requests we’re making make life easier for cis people once y’all get used to us being around.

[–] [email protected] 32 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

Conservatives come in two types. The rich ones who want more and more money. And the poor ones who also want more money but are unable to obtain it because the rich hoard money.

The rich conservatives need to stop the poor conservatives from realizing the rich are why the poor can’t get money. So they make up vulnerable groups to blame for the poor’s problem, and the poor are generally too poorly educated to catch on to this game.

Different groups have been the scapegoat. Women, blacks, the italians, the irish, asians, gays, and now it’s transgender people.

The good news is transgender people WILL get full rights in about 20-30 years if you look at historical cycles. The bad news is it will be a fight and many will die before they get treated as human beings by these asshole conservatives.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

I think earth’s current environment is going to collapse in 20-30 years.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 hours ago

True egalitarianism

[–] [email protected] 9 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

Because hateful people always need an other. an outsider. Someone be fearful of, yet feel smugly superior too

It used to be black people.

then it was the irish and the itallians.

then it was hispanics.

then it was gays

and now its trans people.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 9 hours ago

They are just propagandized. In general, it's so much like racists - they may know trans people and just think they are the exceptions, like them as individuals and still think they hate them as a group. They are intentionally riled up by being forced fed edge cases and disinformation.

Trans people are just people. They aren't angels who are never criminals and they aren't degenerates who are always criminal, they are a diverse group like all of us are. But you can bet your ass that whenever a trans person does something criminal it will be blown up so big in conservative media and used to paint them all as criminals. It's just the right wing media machine.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago) (3 children)

How to say it delicately.. Many conservative/religious men really, truly want to just impale their throats on lady dick, but they are indoctrinated from birth to believe that a zombie from space (who they agree watches them shower and have sex) will be mad at them if they do what makes them happy. So to distract themselves from that always burning urge to ravenously aspirate dong nog, they performatively hate things as a hobby to pass the time until they die - profoundly alone and completely unhappy (see Lindsey Graham)

And then the conservative women are taught that they are stupid, useless furniture pieces there to look pretty and parrot - not capable of an opinion outside of the one provided by their husband or father.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 hours ago (3 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 8 hours ago

Even trans people aren't beating the "nearly all mass shooters are men" statistic.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 8 hours ago

He must have been bullied terribly.

The interesting thing about the furor over trans people existing is that 90% of any harm, real or imagined, stems from mistreatment of people. Conservatives treat trans people badly (supposedly) due to mental issues that are caused by the way conservatives treat trans people.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 hours ago

Remember how the police/Alex Jones kept making big talk about a “manifesto” which never manifested?

[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 hours ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 5 points 8 hours ago (5 children)

There are plenty of atheist transphobes.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

Fascists are cowards who attack the most vulnerable people as a standard tactic.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

And after they exterminate one group, they move onto another

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[–] [email protected] 36 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

You all are overthinking it way too much.

Most people hate anything that's different or uncommon to themselves and their "world".

Simple as that.

It's heterophobia in the semantic sense of the word "fear of anything that's different".

[–] [email protected] 12 points 12 hours ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 10 points 12 hours ago (3 children)

I always thought that xenos was more refering to people from outside, like physically from a different place.

But I really know nothing about words, greek, latin or whatever. So it will probably be a better choice of words.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 13 hours ago (2 children)

Far simpler than whateveryone else is saying. The best way to rally humans to your side is to give them a common enemy. So conservative politicians picked enemies that are small in number and told everyone how they are to blame for all that is wrong in the world.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 10 hours ago

They have to have somebody to hate so they don't hate themselves so much.

[–] [email protected] 79 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

For a simple example: my mother is Catholic and until Trump came along, a lifelong single-issue Republican voter who always said she would be a Democrat if it weren't for abortion. She attends church in an extremely progressive, famously LGBTQ-friendly town.

There's a transwoman who attends her church (let's call her Rita). This lady is probably in her mid-50s to mid-60s and has been a fixture at the church for at least 5 years. My mom has been in choir and bible study groups with her for years now. She still just can't see Rita as a woman. Treats her politely but behind her back refuses to call her "she" and says she's a "man in a dress".

She's really offended that Rita uses the ladies' room. I've asked her why and she can't articulate it, she just feels like it's an invasion of her privacy, because men don't belong in the ladies' room. And when I point out that Rita isn't a man, she just rolls her eyes. I've asked her if she's worried that Rita is in there for predatory purposes and she admits that she doesn't think Rita intends any harm. I've asked her how she'd feel if she were forced to use the men's room and she says "but that's different!"

My mom prides herself in being a moral person, and still can't manage to get past her bigotry to see Rita as a woman. There are just too many mental blockades against it. But since she thinks she's so highly moral, she thinks she must be correct in this situation. It excuses her from finding empathy and bettering her attitude toward trans folks.

My longwinded point is that when people who consider themselves highly moral are bigoted, there's almost zero chance of getting through to them. And I think a lot of the people who are bigoted against trans folks feel that morality is on their side and being trans is morally deviant, so they think they're justified in their prejudice.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

Sorted by controversial, wish me luck boys!

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 hours ago

I'm pretty sure they just think it's icky.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

I don't think it's most people. I (choose to) believe that's a loud minority.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 10 hours ago

Most of the culture wars bullshit is originating from a tiny but disproportionately noisy number of people.

But then, because their claims are so outrageous, the media picks up onbit and runs with it, without bothering to be proportional to the number of people causing the problem in the format place.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago)

Because there are only 2 possibilities:

  1. Trans people are real and the Bible is a book filled to the brim with bullshit

or

  1. Trans people are not real but merely EVIL men and women possessed by Satan because god created Adam and Eve, not they and them

They are in fact mutually exclusive. So what do you think the moron cult members will choose, the option that requires deprogramming... or the option that aligns with their stupid bullshit cult beliefs?

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