this post was submitted on 26 Jun 2023
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Lemmy

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67 users here now

Everything about Lemmy; bugs, gripes, praises, and advocacy.

For discussion about the lemmy.ml instance, go to [email protected].

founded 4 years ago
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The screenshot shows the recommendations from https://join-lemmy.org/.

Still being federated with exploding-heads does not mean the instance supports them. But it means that shit-heads are allowed to take part in the discussions on their communities. They do intoxicate the discussions we will have. They will attack minorities. Maybe you will not be harassed by them, more vulnerable people will be. They are allowed to moderate communities on these instances. Exploding-heads members actively guide young and unknowing people to their hateful instance.

They try to start discussions about the holocaust https://sh.itjust.works/post/227268. They create communities only to crosspost exploding-heads content https://lemmy.world/c/pharma They take over discussions against them https://exploding-heads.com/comment/132189 "WHY are vulnerable people joining a decentralized system? Isnt this why you want a closed, not for public eyes community?"

This was a link to exploding-heads, because when someone copies a permalink of a comment from them on another instance, it will be a link to their instance.

Are we building a place where vulnerable people are welcome and safe or are we building a place where nazis are welcome and safe?

They want you to block them, they comment that everywhere. They block people who are in favor of defederating them https://sh.itjust.works/post/225714 When their opponents won't see them anymore, they can harass and recruit without being noticed.

Blocking will not solve the problem. They will spread even when you close your eyes.

~~Maybe this was not done intentionally, but now~~ there is a post with a list of 'health communities on Lemmy' with the first entry guiding to exploding heads. https://lemmy.world/post/396561

It is still possible that some of the mentioned instances do support them. The owner of sh.itjust.works says that because of “free speech” all other instances would be allowed. It is suspicious to me that his line is drawn only for lemmygrad https://sh.itjust.works/comment/130474

The decision to block the Lemmygrad instance was less a question of censorship, and more an issue of personal conviction. As a volunteer dedicating my personal resources and time to facilitating a space for users to create, discover, and discuss - not just on this instance, but across the Fediverse - I admit that this choice was made alone, selfishly, without the consent or thoroughly considering the collective opinion of the community. With the above said, sh.itjust.works has had the lemmygrad instance blocked from its first day.

I’d like to also point out that the lemmygrad instance has far more blocked instances than what is currently blocked here. Maybe you can create a post on that instance to see what that’s all about and report back?

At the same time they seem to ignore the call and vote to defederate with exploding-heads https://sh.itjust.works/post/433483.

They rejected to delete The_Donald from sh.itjust.works until they feared to get isolated from the other instances: https://lemmy.ml/post/1467310. They where aware of The_Donald and ignored early warnings. (https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/comment/266248). TD was more important to them than keeping the only mod of their 4th biggest community c/patientgamers (https://sh.itjust.works/post/291747, https://sh.itjust.works/post/388922)

Since The_Donald was removed, I did not find more racist content on the mentioned servers. That is part their tactics. They act harmless but recruit to their instance, attract likeminded people and chase others away. Discussions on sh.itjust.works about such topics are very toxic already, soon they might be able to do more harm.

(My research is very limited, as i could not search for all exploding-heads member content on other instances by entering their domain. I know there are nice communities on sh.itjust.works.)

What can be done? On joinmastodon.org there is a Mastodon Server Covenant with very few useful rules, one of them is "Active moderation against racism, sexism, homophobia and transphobia". https://joinmastodon.org/covenant It would be a first step to implement these rules for join-lemmy.org. At least instances that want to be recommended on there should have to agree to that rule.

More actions should be taken now. Please make suggestions. Things will only become more complicated. The next reddit wave is incoming.

For those who did not already know:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

https://www.upworthy.com/bartender-explains-why-he-swiftly-kicks-nazis-out-of-his-punk-bar-even-if-theyre-not-bothering-anyone

This is not the first time new platforms face these problems, do we really have to repeat the same mistakes?

-Share/crosspost

-Contact admins

update: lemmy.word defederated eh

(page 2) 41 comments
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[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

As a lemmy.one user I will move to somewhere else after bringing this up. Any recommended places to move to?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Oh no! Anyway. Welcome to the internet. Not everyone is going to be nice.

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (4 children)

So, dumb question but what is exploding-heads? Are they actual Nazis or like far-right wackos and MAGA nuts?

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[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

enjoy your echo chamber

edit: i just went and looked over there, you guys are lying, they aren't nazis.

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[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

MOM!!! People are disagreeing with me!!!! :(

Pwease defederate

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Lick my unwashed taint chud

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[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago

I've gone there and they don't seem like nazis??? They seem to just recommend that people who get offended easily block the places they don't like

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

How about you curate your own filters and take care of your own filter-bubble (or echo-chamber for that matter)? The beauty of the Fediverse is that there's no central instance to censor or dictate the course.

Start your own instance if you dislike the open marketplace of opinions.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (4 children)

To everyone downvoting this because you can't stand your opinion being challenged:

I invite you to a discussion here.

PD: I am here in the Fediverse because I like to challenge other opinions as much as being challenged, this is how we, how humanity grows, learns and evolves. I'm not here to live in a safe space/echo-chamber and being reassured, this would be boring and mind-numbing.

Get out there, learn new things, test your opinions, ideals and biases against others and see how they evolve.

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[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It is fascinating to watch a lot of people who got purged from social media for being too leftist and flocked to a defederated forum created by free speech enjoyers go on to immediately start complaining about the lack of censorship and damning the concept of free speech having learned nothing in the process.

The most popular suggestion here seems to be isolating yourselves from any part of the Fediverse which doesn't accept your demands. Now, if we could just get the Nazis to be stupid enough to follow in your footsteps and curtail their own methods of ideological propagation, this place might actually start to be kind of chill.

Instead they keep fucking talking to people and trying to convince them of stuff, which has proven vastly more efficient in achieving their goals. I am severely disappointed in all of you for making Nazis look intelligent by comparison.

I welcome your down votes, as disapproval from you is a mark that my brain is not grossly malfunctioning.

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[–] [email protected] -2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Given that at no time in human history has shit ever "just worked" without looking from an extremely narrow viewpoint, I think it's fairly easy to discern this Instance's goals: to be a bridge from the extreme right to the rest of the community.

Certainly fits the pattern.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's a bit far-fetched. The name "shit just works" doesn't have any right-wing connotations. If you google it you get Bethesda memes and some Apple stuff.

I think the admin is just one dude who wasn't prepared for their instance to become so big. So far they've done the right thing given a couple days. Yesterday I saw an "anti vax" community on sh.itjustwor.ks, I reported it, today it's gone.

Until I see an actual "actually we should debate the Nazis" comment from them or maybe like a week has passed without action I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

It's not a meme. It's a paraphrasing of a basic philosophy that runs contradictory to most others in the modern world. You know it when you see it.

You can give the benefit of the doubt to whomever you like. But this is not some universal open communication platform like some may wish it to be. (we already have one of those, it's called 4chan) It's just a social media organization, just like dozens before it. That's why we have the tools that we do.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 2 years ago (25 children)

you know you can just block them yourself right? you don't have to force your opinion on everyone. if most people block them they will become just as isolated as if they were defederated anyways.

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