304
submitted 1 day ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
top 19 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] [email protected] 4 points 20 hours ago

Reminder that Marx and Lincoln corresponded via letters, and that Marx was impressed enough to call on European communists to volunteer with the US military to get good exercise in hunting down slaver scum for sport.

[-] [email protected] 5 points 19 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago)

Reminder that Marx and Lincoln corresponded via letters

Just the one - or two, if one prefers - I believe. Marx sent a letter on behalf of some socialist org he was a part of, and Lincoln returned a short, though positive, response. Lincoln was also a regular reader of a newspaper Marx regularly contributed to, so he was likely at least somewhat aware of who Marx was beforehand.

It is very interesting, though - it shows how much of a 'big tent' antislavery party the Republican Party was at the time, and that it included ideologies that were not hostile to socialism, even as a high up as Lincoln.

Lincoln never seriously contested the existence of capitalism, to my knowledge, but generally spoke with a very strong pro-labor and pro-collective action bend. One might think of him as a pre-welfare state socdem.

[-] [email protected] 14 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

For those wondering, this is part of a quote attributed to Lincoln by Teddy Roosevelt in a 1910 speech where he attributes several quotes to Lincoln. A fuller excerpt of the Roosevelt speech is as follows:

Part of our debt to [Lincoln] is because he forecast our present struggle and saw the way out. He said: "I hold that while man exists it is his duty to improve not only his own condition, but to assist in ameliorating mankind." And again: "Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." If that remark was original with me, I should be even more strongly denounced as a Communist agitator than I shall be anyhow. It is Lincoln’s. I am only quoting it; and that is one side; that is the side the capitalist should hear. Now, let the working man hear his side. "Capital has its rights, which are as worthy of protection as any other rights. . . . Nor should this lead to a war upon the owners of property. Property is the fruit of labor; . . . property is desirable; is a positive good in the world." And then comes a thoroughly Lincoln-like sentence: "Let not him who is houseless pull down the house of another, but let him work diligently and build one for himself, thus by example assuring that his own shall be safe from violence when built."

[-] [email protected] 8 points 1 day ago
[-] [email protected] 6 points 1 day ago

Oh wow, I can't believe I only ever knew this as Teddy quoting Lincoln. I never actually bothered to look it up to confirm it, but it makes sense that it would be a State of the Union. Genuinely thank you for that. For those interested in reading it, Wikipedia has a sister project called Wikisource that houses the full texts of this sort of thing.

[-] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

I actually noticed the wikisource link at the bottom right after I posted the wikipedia article lmao. Talk about bad timing on my part.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

"Capital has its rights, which are as worthy of protection as any other rights. . . . Nor should this lead to a war upon the owners of property. Property is the fruit of labor; . . . property is desirable; is a positive good in the world." And then comes a thoroughly Lincoln-like sentence: "Let not him who is houseless pull down the house of another, but let him work diligently and build one for himself, thus by example assuring that his own shall be safe from violence when built."

Lemmy is going to pull you out of your home and hang you by the nearest streetlamp. How DARE you!

[-] [email protected] 5 points 1 day ago

Labor is prior to and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. Capital has its rights, which are as worthy of protection as any other rights. Nor is it denied that there is, and probably always will be, a relation between labor and capital producing mutual benefits. The error is in assuming that the whole labor of community exists within that relation. A few men own capital, and that few avoid labor themselves, and with their capital hire or buy another few to labor for them. A large majority belong to neither class—neither work for others nor have others working for them. In most of the Southern States a majority of the whole people of all colors are neither slaves nor masters, while in the Northern a large majority are neither hirers nor hired. Men, with their families—wives, sons, and daughters—work for themselves on their farms, in their houses, and in their shops, taking the whole product to themselves, and asking no favors of capital on the one hand nor of hired laborers or slaves on the other. It is not forgotten that a considerable number of persons mingle their own labor with capital; that is, they labor with their own hands and also buy or hire others to labor for them; but this is only a mixed and not a distinct class. No principle stated is disturbed by the existence of this mixed class.

Again, as has already been said, there is not of necessity any such thing as the free hired laborer being fixed to that condition for life. Many independent men everywhere in these States a few years back in their lives were hired laborers. The prudent, penniless beginner in the world labors for wages awhile, saves a surplus with which to buy tools or land for himself, then labors on his own account another while, and at length hires another new beginner to help him. This is the just and generous and prosperous system which opens the way to all, gives hope to all, and consequent energy and progress and improvement of condition to all. No men living are more worthy to be trusted than those who toil up from poverty; none less inclined to take or touch aught which they have not honestly earned. Let them beware of surrendering a political power which they already possess, and which if surrendered will surely be used to close the door of advancement against such as they and to fix new disabilities and burdens upon them till all of liberty shall be lost.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

Reads like Eisenhower warning about the military industrial complex.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Cassandra truths seem a recurring theme in world history.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Oh, to be clear, I massively disagree with that part of the quote; I'm just presenting that part because it would be pretty deliberate misrepresentation otherwise.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

*worst motivational speaker ever.

this post was submitted on 25 Sep 2024
304 points (99.4% liked)

Political Memes

5260 readers
2702 users here now

Welcome to politcal memes!

These are our rules:

Be civilJokes are okay, but don’t intentionally harass or disturb any member of our community. Sexism, racism and bigotry are not allowed. Good faith argumentation only. No posts discouraging people to vote or shaming people for voting.

No misinformationDon’t post any intentional misinformation. When asked by mods, provide sources for any claims you make.

Posts should be memesRandom pictures do not qualify as memes. Relevance to politics is required.

No bots, spam or self-promotionFollow instance rules, ask for your bot to be allowed on this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS