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submitted 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

For context:

I've been using Linux since 2000. Started with Mandrake Linux (Helios?), then I moved to Ubuntu in 2004 and alternated between Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Ubuntu MATE for a time until I settled with Kubuntu for the last few years.

Ubuntu has been rock solid for me for the past 20 years and I'm used to the APT package management and Ubuntu/Debian environment overall with all the various services and configs, setups and release cycles, etc. The stability allows me to enjoy my spare time playing games and doing other important tasks instead of troubleshooting my system and figuring out how to make something work. Ubuntu has been awesome in that regard.

I've also been dual-booting this whole time with Windows. Gaming on Linux simply wasn't up to snuff up until very recently with Steam working on Wine and Proton for the Steam Deck and Bottles, which makes running Windows games on Linux almost comparable to Windows.

Windows 10 was a great OS, except for a few flaws and privacy issues with the introduction of mandatory Microsoft accounts and One Drive integration. But you could work around those things. It was supposed to be the last Windows we would have to install with perpetual rolling releases, but apparently they changed their minds about that. Windows 11 was released and reading about it gives me nightmares. Using it for work also has been an incredibly buggy and frustrating experience. The invasion of privacy, data collection, screen monitoring and AI integration plus the additional advertisement are all reasons for which I will never install this OS on my personal computer. And some of these features have started to leak into Windows 10.

So I've made up my mind. I'm wiping Windows from my PC and will be running Linux only. I believe it's become good enough to use as a daily driver for a home gaming desktop and for productivity. But... Which distribution should I choose?

The dilemma:

There's been a whole slew of new Linux distributions that have come out lately. Some have been early in the Linux gaming aspect such as POP! OS. Others have tried to become a solid replacement for the default immutable Steam OS such as Bazzite. And there are now some pretty awesome sounding gaming-focused distros such as Nobara. And that's on top of the various existing Ubuntu flavors, Fedora's spins, OpenSuse and the many Arch variants that almost seem to pop up monthly.

I've been shopping around for a distribution to become my daily driver from now until who knows when. I'm expecting to stick to that distro as long as possible. Here's some of the things that I am looking for:

  • Not immutable : I find this to be adapted for devices like tablets, IoT devices and handhelds instead of an actual PC. I'll need to be able to change my system configs as I please and an Immutable distro seems like a pain in the butt to deal with that.
  • Rock solid : This is the most important aspect and is why a lot of the Arch or other bleeding edge distros won't do. (With some exceptions)
  • Hardware support : The second most important aspect. I think that's pretty much covered by most popular distros, but some have better support than others. Especially for ease of getting the right drivers. (Especially for NVidia GPUs, or gaming controllers and devices.)
  • Performance : Most popular distros offer ok performance, but some have been enhanced to provide improved performance according to the hardware. This is a very big nice to have, especially for gaming.
  • Desktop choice : I'm really not a big fan of Gnome 3. It seems nobody really is. Many Gnome based distros come with quality of life extensions out of the box to fix that. Not a big fan of GTK apps' UI ergonomics either. That's why I prefer KDE over Gnome or Cinnamon. Budgie seems like a great alternative as well. Also having a PowerToys-style FancyZones tiling system is a big big plus (KDE has that OOTB)
  • Applications : The thing I love about Ubuntu is the amount of available applications in their repos. I'm hoping to have the same availability in my next distribution.
  • Online community/support : Having a great online support community is very important. The more users, the larger the knowledge base and the easier you can find answers to questions to troubleshoot problems.
  • Online services integration : Optional but a very nice to have would be to have integration with Google apps like GMail, Calendar, Keep and Google Drive to name a few.
  • Customization : As funny as this sounds, I want to use the desktop in its most vanilla form as possible with as few customisations as possible. Over time I found that having extra customisations like extensions, applets, etc tends to break things because of lack of support over time. It's also more difficult to troubleshoot when very few people are using them.

The distributions that ended up meeting my requirements are the following in order of preferences :

  • Kubuntu : So far its been working great for gaming but I think there could be some performance improvements. It's my first choice because I'm just so comfortable with it already. Zero effort, but with some compromises in performance.
  • Nobara with KDE Plasma : This looks solid and ticks all the requirements. I think there's some amount of learning to do for using YUM/RPM packages and to understand some of the customisations, but I think this effort will be minimal. I am concerned about long term support however since this is a fairly new distro supported by individuals.
  • Ubuntu Budgie : I really like this DE, very simple but elegant. But, like Kubuntu, I don't know how it's going to fare performance wise. And I don't know what kind of tools there are to configure gaming controllers, etc.
  • Ubuntu (I'm willing to deal with Gnome 3 for simplicity's sake)
  • Fedora KDE Plasma spin : Everybody is raving about Fedora so maybe I'll give it a shot as an Ubuntu replacement.
  • ~~Manjaro~~ Endeavour OS with KDE desktop :Possibly the only Arch distro I'm willing to install because they focus on stability, however learning about the packaging system and configs/environment feels like a drag. But with the great community and documentation I'm willing to make an effort for this one.

What are your thoughts on this? What are your recommendations based on my requirements?

EDIT:

Thank you very much for everyone's input. I've spent a good part of the day installing distros in a VM to check out some of your suggestions and reading more about my choices.

I can't believe I am saying this, but I am reevaluating my choice of using Kubuntu. After some reading I have found out that Ubuntu and it's flavors will not be supporting flatpaks starting in 23.04. And there are several known problems with snap, such as serious performance issues. A task that would take 1-5s as a regular .deb installed app, would take up to 10 times that time to complete. Canonical is also working to modify apt to use snaps instead of installed .deb packages. They are aggressively pushing snaps to a point where they'll want to replace the majority of the software with snaps eventually.

Yeah there's security features built-in and all, which flatpaks don't necessarily have. And the security is tighter around Canonical's snap repos compared to flathub for example. But I don't know if I'm ready to move to that new way of doing things. And Canonical is going against what the community wants.

I don't know. I think I'm more confused now that I was when I started...

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[-] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

Is mint good for gaming? I'm looking to switch as well

[-] [email protected] 0 points 1 day ago

Absolutely.

  • It's desktop environment is very light on resource usage and very easy to use. It's great for new Linux users.
  • It's package repository includes Ubuntu's which is rich with great up to date and stable and secure packages. Plus Mint adds it's own to allow the user to avoid using Snap packages. (You can ask if you're not sure what that is. I don't know your level of experience in Linux.)
  • Because it's based on Ubuntu you also have the little added features that allow you to install 3rd party audio/video codecs to play proprietary formats and to install and manage proprietary graphics drivers as well. (Nvidia for example).
  • There's great hardware support for PC hardware and gaming devices.
  • There's a huge community and lots of documentation for Ubuntu and Mint.

It's a great no hassle OS for both gaming and productivity.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 1 hour ago

Thanks!

Why'd you get downvoted though?

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 hour ago

Meh. It's just one downvote. No big dick.

[-] [email protected] 8 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

For gaming you want the latest updates. Of all the major distros, only Arch, Suse and Fedora provide that. Arch requires you to learn to about and fix breakage. Fedora has a gaming spin which works like a Steam Deck: Bazzite.

I've distro hopped between 10+ distros, and Bazzite has been the only one that gave me a rock solid stability and latest drivers simultaneously. It's not purely immutable, Fedora calls it Atomic.

I suggest you try it, and tell me if there was anything you couldn't do.

Also: I don't support Canonical's walled garden

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

What if I have basically the same requirements as OP but for gaming only Minecraft has to work (which I assume isn't an issue on any distro)

i7 11800h and Nvidia RTX 3060 Laptop if that matters

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Two options: java edition, or mobile bedrock. Both have launchers available.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Realistically one option: Java edition (why would I play bedrock)

(But I was asking for a distro recommendation, not a Minecraft recommendations. Ty though.)

I'm assuming when my only game is Minecraft I don't need bleeding edge support, right? Just any stable linux distro should work fine?

[-] [email protected] 1 points 23 hours ago

Absolutely, what's the chance of Java Edition requiring the latest updates to VRR / HDR / Mesa / etc. ?

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[-] [email protected] 23 points 2 days ago

Nice list, though I would remove Manjaro from that. Manjaro is far from stable, they just delay Arch packages without even testing and it will bork itself in no time or will cause some problems at least.

Anyway, I see you have included Fedora based, so I would like to suggest OpenSUSE Tumbleweed. I installed it on my sister's PC and she's been happily using it for some time now. Previously she borked Manjaro and brake updates on Pop OS just by using the system via GUI. That didn't happen on Tumbleweed yet and I don't think it will. Even if something would happen, she can revert everything by selecting a recovery image from GRUB and continue using it.

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[-] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

This might not help, but I'd seriously recommend reconsidering Arch derivatives.

I've been 100% Linux for almost 2 years now, with Garuda Linux on my primary desktop and Fedora on my laptop. I've had zero major issues with Garuda (and very few minor ones, to the point I can't think of any specific problems in the moment), gaming performance has been fantastic, and the availability of software in the AUR is nothing short of amazing.

In my experience, keeping up with updates is not at all an impediment to use, and I've yet to have stability issues of any kind. I've been seriously considering replacing Fedora with Garuda on my laptop, the experience has been so smooth.

Just stay away from Manjaro. I feel like Arch fan-boys being dicks and people recommending Manjaro to new Linux converts are the only two problems with Arch (or at least its derivite distros, I haven't raw dogged vanilla Arch before).

[-] [email protected] 4 points 1 day ago

I think it's important to keep in mind here that there is a very marked difference between vanilla Arch and its derivatives. A lot of derivatives will set up a lot of base system software with sensible defaults, whereas with vanilla Arch it's often up to you to find out that you need that software, and then you also need to figure out a lot of configuration. Not having to do that saves you from a lot of issues.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 1 day ago

Sounds about like I would expect. I do feel like a lot of the "Core" distros are similar though, although not to the same degree. You get more "out of the box" from something like Mint or PopOS than you do straight Debian, for example.

The derivative distros i've tried come with a lot of help getting things setup just how you want/need, a lot of it GUI based which is nice for new converts.

[-] [email protected] 5 points 2 days ago

Manjaro

I highly recommend avoiding manjaro like the plague, their team is incredibly incompetent (see: https://manjarno.pages.dev/ ), I say this as someone who has given people manjaro for years and regretted it, I was also their it person, manjaro regularly broke every few months and gave people a very bad taste of linux

for example, why are kernels given version numbers in packages? This caused 3 separate peoples computers to break multiple times. Everything good about manjaro comes from arch, everything bad about manjaro comes from the manjaro team.

Y’know how it’s not rolling release because they delay packages by 2 weeks? They actually do no testing in this time. How do I know this? They pushed an update that caused steam to uninstall your desktop environment. Famously covered by linus tech tips… this is something that should have easily been caught, and yet the two week window did absolutely nothing.

the truth is for manjaro there is no real usecase, there’s no set of desires that align with manjaro being the best choice for you. I am not asking you to switch away from manjaro, but I do not think we should ever recommend it to anyone, and on your next machine, I recommend trying the arch installer.

But if what you’re looking for is an easy pre-setup arch, use endeavoros

If you want something simple and up to date, use fedora kinoite

If you’re a power user and want to configure every little thing about their system, use arch or nixos

If you don’t care at all about updates and want the most rock solid system possible, debian.

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[-] [email protected] 11 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

I'm not sure what performance improvements you're talking about. As far as I'm aware, the difference between distros on performance is extremely minimal. What does matter is how up to date the DE is in the distribution provided package. For example, I wanted some nvidia+Wayland improvements that were only in kwin 6.1, and so I switched from kubuntu to neon in order to get them (and also definitely sacrificed some stability since more broken packages/combinations get pushed to users than in base ubuntu). It's also possible that the kernel version might matter in some cases, but I haven't run into this personally.

I think the main differences between distros is how apps are packaged and the defaults provided, and if you're most comfortable with apt based systems, I'm not sure what benefit there's going to be to switching (other than the joy in tinkering and learning something new, which can be fun in its own right).

For some users less experienced with linux, the initial effort required to setup Ubuntu for gaming (installing graphics drivers/possibly setting kernel options, etc) might push someone toward a distribution that removes that barrier, but the end state is going to be basically identical to whatever you've setup yourself.

The choice between distributions is probably more 'what do I want the process to getting to my desired end state to be like' and less 'how do I want the computer to run'.

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[-] [email protected] 9 points 2 days ago

Nice write up, seems like you know what you are jumping into atleast. Personally would recommend to give Bazzite a try and not rule out immutables too quickly, nothing is more solid than these variants. If not immutable, then my best experience lies with Opensuse TW by far. Super stable, yet bleeding edge.

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[-] [email protected] 10 points 2 days ago

My recommendation would be setting up Nobara with a separate home partition so you can easily switch if it stops being supported, although there are no sign of this yet. My second recommendation would be Opensuse Leap, it is more stable and well established but less optimized for gaming. Maybe take another look at Pop OS! when they release their independent new desktop. If you go with base Fedora be aware setting up codecs can be annoying. Avoid Manjaro, the distro breaks a lot due to dependency conflicts. Also I think you mean GNOME 40, GNOME 3 is the old design.

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[-] [email protected] 3 points 2 days ago

Linux newbie here, so this information may be for other newbies. I tried Nobara when I had problems with my Manjaro. But Nobara fresh out the box had some problems and it being a "one person project" kinda bugged me. Also not having the AUR(Arch User Repository) anymore was making me try Endeavour OS.

Manjaro is pretty good, but Endeavour OS has better Nvidia integration, also it comes with yay and other quality of life stuff already setup. Better for a noob like me.

Oh, I also tried Fedora KDE but at that point I was hooked to Arch. It is just so much easier to install programs from AUR with the terminal than what other distros try with "app-stores"

[-] [email protected] 3 points 1 day ago

Hi! Yeah upon further reading thanks to the great replies I received here, I've reconsidered using Nobara. The one guy's project aspect of it scares me in terms of long term support. This needs to become an official Fedora project or even community project supported by a community at least.

I was really thinking of Endeavour OS rather than Manjaro. But I've never used an Arch based distro before. Been on Ubuntu flavors for the past 20 years. I mean there's probably people on here that replied that weren't even born when I started using it lol!!! (Fuck I'm old)

Reading about AUR gives me a feeling of insecurity. It sounds like a repo of packages that anyone can push and distribute.

Also, I remember there being some issues with Arch, among other distros, being too bleeding edge and receiving packages with security problems. Something about a backdoor in SSH. Maybe being too bleeding edge is a double "edged" sword.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

Security is a give and take, and with bleeding edge you have to balance it more. Yes bleeding edge can mean bleeding hearts when a security issue is discovered in new code. But just as often, if not more frequently, it also means you get security patches before almost anyone else. And the AUR is insecure, as it's a user repository. But 99% of the time if you read the PKGBUILD (it's really easy, you can usually skim it) and check the sources you'll be fine. The AUR being insecure isn't bad, it just means you need to put more effort into checking on stuff and you need to be responsible for your security. These aren't bad habits to have in general, but it's a bit of a learning curve coming from systems that expect to handle most of your security for you.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 2 days ago

I'm a die-hard Ubuntu fan, but just use whatever works for you.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 2 days ago

Same. But I've been questioning my loyalty lately because of their obsession with Snap. Canonical has been increasingly imposing their business decisions on their users and it's a bit off putting.

I'm considering moving to Fedora or maybe even OpenSuse. Possibly even Endeavor! I can't believe I'd ever consider an Arch based distro.

Honestly this research has left me even more indecisive about what to install. But I have an increasingly big feeling that I might be ditching Ubuntu. I don't think anyone should be messing with APT in such a way that it would end up installing snap packages instead of debian packages. This is too much.

They should simply provide the option to use snaps to users in the app store and not enforce it like with some apps, such as Firefox and Thunderbird.

[-] [email protected] 8 points 2 days ago

Regarding your not wanting to go with an immutable distro: what configs are you thinking you'll need to mess with that makes an immutable distro a bad idea exactly? I was previously on the fence about it as well but Bazzite has absolutely served my needs and requires way less fiddling than my previous Nobara install did after major updates. I have yet to find any day to day configurations that I haven't been able to overcome with OSTree overlaying. Aside from being immutable, Bazzite literally checks every other box you've got listed.

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[-] [email protected] 3 points 2 days ago

My advice is: make your data eternal, not your distro. Your kde config and customization should work across distros (but don't dualboot with 2 distros messing in the same /home). Don't know about you, but I like the separated work/play dynamic I have with linux/windows so I'm waiting for bazzite to become dual bootable with linux to be my playstation. If you put your game library on it's own partition/disk you can mount it from dualboot distros.

Every distribution is always the most stabellest, maintained piece of software on their website but fuckups happen, teams change, users get blamed for exotic circumstances tarnishing their reputation. Have a backup and use whatever feels right currently.

Pop_os is also ubuntu based btw, hate the name but maybe system76 is able to keep you safe from the snappification while you use what you are accustumed to?

[-] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago

Thanks for the advice, but I want to avoid dual-booting altogether. I would prefer to install and forget. Then upgrade when new stable releases come around.

[-] [email protected] 7 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

+1 for Fedora KDE. I've been daily driving it for 2 years now and its given me very little problems. I stopped using Windows about 5 years ago now and haven't looked back, and after distro hopping for a bit, I'm pretty satisfied with my experience with Fedora. Initial setup can take a little bit because theres some repos you need to add/enable to get nonfree software (including video/audio codecs that basically every website ever uses), but once you do that its pretty solid. You get pretty up-to-date software without it being so new that things break after every other update. It strikes a nice balance.

However, if you're familiar and comfortable with Ubuntu, you'll likely be just fine sticking with that. You probably won't notice huge performance differences between distros. It sounds like the bigger concern is if you're safe to just nuke Windows and I'm not going to be the one to discourage you from doing that. Up to you if you want to try something new or not.

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this post was submitted on 24 Sep 2024
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